tlarkin

I had 1 gig of ram, basic stuff running like a web browser and word and had over 300mb free of RAM, and it ran like ass. Now I can boot up any other OS, use 700mb of RAM on it multi tasking and still have 300 free, and they all run better. I test things out with the same control, that way it makes it a bit more fair on comparison. Vista memory management is horrid, poorly written, and utterly busted compared to every other OS out there. I put the vista machine in the same conditions as every other OS, 700mb used, and 300mb free (before I added another gig, and then that didn't change anything either). The other OSes I had to launch other applications to make up for it, but photoshop will eat up some RAM so it wasn't too hard to accomplish.

I think you need to read up on how memory works, and don't get me started on how vista manages virtual memory, because it is way worse than any OS.

Jabes

we'll keep it active till u come back

tuxify

Haha always with the smartass remarks. I just entered this conversation, and I have to say it's intriguing.

*Edit* New avatar <-- to show my support.

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Jabes

ewwww its ugly

ThatGuy16

i can ship you some? it might get old.. maybe i can get next day air?


we will work this out, trust me. your going to get some popcorn

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zaroba

ahh, but you see, heres the thing...i actually TESTED this stuff with my pc.

i only had 1gb of ram in this pc when i went from xp to vista, and it did run slow (which you confirmed). however, instead of downgrading, i decided to do the logical thing and upgrade my ram to compensate for vista's usage. i upgraded to 3gb of ram but hit the 32bit limitation, then went to 64bit vista and got the 5gb that i have now

1gb -> 3gb did show an improvement in general usage.
3gb -> 5gb showed an improvement too, but not as great as the jump from 1 to 3


you can freely test it yourself. go for it, its fun. you learn so much via trial and error.
the funny thing is that its usually drastically different from what people like you say will happen.

you say you own copies of vista. and have confirmed that they are slow on a pc with one gb of ram (which is no surprise, it was slow for me as well). now, try installing vista on a pc with 4gb of ram to see how well it will work. feel free to also install xp on the same pc to compare them. you'll see no performance loss at all.

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tlarkin

That won't make a difference because I don't utilize anything really over 1 gig of RAM on that system. It is a test system I load OSes on and blow it away every so often to install and test out other stuff. It is my trial and error machine, here are the specs

Intel C2d e6300
Intel MB - DG965
2 gigs of RAM
9800 Pro, 256 meg version
OSes: windows xp, vista ultimate, debian, suse, and for a while i had a smooth wall running on it to play around with it

I have a macbook pro which is comparable, but a bit more higher end than this system

C2D 2.2 Ghz
2gig of RAM
x1600 video card

So, that is my OS X comparison to what vista can do, with not the exact, but pretty close specs. And, yes I have loaded both vista and Xp on my macbook pro via boot camp and virtualization both.

I was not gaming on this machine, not editing video or audio, just basic things. Office productivity, web surfing, small time scripting and maybe some DVD and audio play back. Nothing that any OS couldn't handle with just 1 gig of RAM, with the exception that Vista performed the poorest. I never really got above using 1 gig of RAM and your system does not slow down until you use up all your RAM and then it has to start paging virtual memory to make up for the RAM you don't have. So, having anything over 2 gigs of RAM does not help me.

A quick and dirty view to how memory works is this. CPU gets an instruction, and it goes first to the CACHE to look for it, and that is the fastest way to get an instruction set. Tons of common tasks are loaded into cache memory. Some systems (limited) will have level 3 cache on the motherboard, I really haven't seen many that do this, but I have read that it is out there, so that would be the second place it looks for instruction sets if it is available. If not, it moves on to the not as fast RAM, where applications and the OS load more instruction sets, the CPU pages the RAM next if its not found in Cache. Finally, if you are out of RAM, then it pages virtual memory, which is allocated to your hard disk, which is the slowest way for the cpu to get an instruction set. So, if you are not using any more than 1 gig of RAM at any given time, having 4 gigs of RAM is pointless and it is not faster by any means. This is the basics of how it works, I suggest you google or wikipedia search it for more in depth and more accurate explanations. I warn you though, its a pretty dry and boring read.

INTELCRAZY

I didn't say you were running Basic... I said WHO, not YOU, but WHO...

You are the one who NEVER, I mean EVER, mentions pros of Vista...

-DX10
-It boots faster than XP, I have noticed this myself
-Definitely not the uglier interface, XP is a troll...
-As pointed out in an article, saves power, must be doing something right, again


Just for you:

* Windows Aero: The new hardware-based graphical user interface, named Windows Aero – an acronym for Authentic, Energetic, Reflective, and Open. The new interface is intended to be cleaner and more aesthetically pleasing than those of previous Windows, including new transparencies, live thumbnails, live icons, animations, and eye candy.
* Windows Shell: The new Windows shell is significantly different from Windows XP, offering a new range of organization, navigation, and search capabilities. Windows Explorer's task panel has been removed, integrating the relevant task options into the toolbar. A "Favorite links" panel has been added, enabling one-click access to common directories. The address bar has been replaced with a breadcrumb navigation system. The preview panel allows users to see thumbnails of various files and view the contents of documents. The details panel shows information such as file size and type, and allows viewing and editing of embedded tags in supported file formats. The Start menu has changed as well; it no longer uses ever-expanding boxes when navigating through Programs. The word "Start" itself has been removed in favor of a blue Windows Orb (also called "Pearl").
* Instant Search (also known as search as you type): Windows Vista features a new way of searching called Instant Search, which is significantly faster and more in-depth (content-based) than the search features found in any of the previous versions of Windows.[8]
* Windows Sidebar: A transparent panel anchored to the side of the screen where a user can place Desktop Gadgets, which are small applets designed for a specialized purpose (such as displaying the weather or sports scores). Gadgets can also be placed on other parts of the desktop.
* Windows Internet Explorer 7: New user interface, tabbed browsing, RSS, a search box, improved printing,[9] Page Zoom, Quick Tabs (thumbnails of all open tabs), Anti-Phishing filter, a number of new security protection features, Internationalized Domain Name support (IDN), and improved web standards support. IE7 in Windows Vista runs in isolation from other applications in the operating system (protected mode); exploits and malicious software are restricted from writing to any location beyond Temporary Internet Files without explicit user consent.

Windows Media Player 11
Windows Media Player 11

* Windows Media Player 11, a major revamp of Microsoft's program for playing and organizing music and video. New features in this version include word wheeling (or "search as you type"), a new GUI for the media library, photo display and organization, the ability to share music libraries over a network with other Vista machines, Xbox 360 integration, and support for other Media Center Extenders.(BUGGY)
* Backup and Restore Center: Includes a backup and restore application that gives users the ability to schedule periodic backups of files on their computer, as well as recovery from previous backups. Backups are incremental, storing only the changes each time, minimizing the disk usage. It also features Complete PC Backup (available only in Ultimate, Business, and Enterprise versions) which backs up an entire computer as an image onto a hard disk or DVD. Complete PC Backup can automatically recreate a machine setup onto new hardware or hard disk in case of any hardware failures. Complete PC Restore can be initiated from within Windows Vista, or from the Windows Vista installation CD in the event the PC is so corrupt that it cannot start up normally from the hard disk.
* Windows Mail: A replacement for Outlook Express that includes a new mail store that improves stability,[10] and features integrated Instant Search. It has the Phishing Filter like IE7 and Junk mail filtering that is enhanced through regular updates via Windows Update.[11]
* Windows Calendar is a new calendar and task application.
* Windows Photo Gallery, a photo and movie library management application. WPG can import from digital cameras, tag and rate individual items, adjust colors and exposure, create and display slideshows (with pan and fade effects), and burn slideshows to DVD.
* Windows DVD Maker, a companion program to Windows Movie Maker that provides the ability to create video DVDs based on a user's content. Users can design a DVD with title, menu, video, soundtrack, pan and zoom motion effects on pictures or slides.
* Windows Media Center, which was previously exclusively bundled as a separate version of Windows XP, known as Windows XP Media Center Edition, has been incorporated into the Home Premium and Ultimate editions of Windows Vista.
* Games and Games Explorer: Games included with Windows have been modified to showcase Vista's graphics capabilities. New games are Chess Titans, Mahjong Titans and Purble Place. A new Games Explorer special folder holds shortcuts and information to all games on the user's computer.

Windows Mobility Center.
Windows Mobility Center.

* Windows Mobility Center is a control panel that centralizes the most relevant information related to mobile computing (brightness, sound, battery level / power scheme selection, wireless network, screen orientation, presentation settings, etc.).
* Windows Meeting Space replaces NetMeeting. Users can share applications (or their entire desktop) with other users on the local network, or over the Internet using peer-to-peer technology (higher versions than Starter and Home Basic can take advantage of hosting capabilities, limiting previous to "join" mode only)
* Shadow Copy automatically creates daily backup copies of files and folders. Users can also create "shadow copies" by setting a System Protection Point using the System Protection tab in the System control panel. The user can be presented multiple versions of a file throughout a limited history and be allowed to restore, delete, or copy those versions. This feature is available only in the Business, Enterprise, and Ultimate editions of Windows Vista and is inherited from Windows Server 2003.[12]

Windows Update with Windows Ultimate Extras
Windows Update with Windows Ultimate Extras

* Windows Update: Software and security updates have been simplified,[13] now operating solely via a control panel instead of as a web application. Windows Mail's spam filter and Windows Defender's definitions are updated automatically via Windows Update. Users that choose the recommended setting for Automatic Updates will have the latest drivers installed and available when they add a new device.
* Parental controls: Allows administrators to control which websites, programs, and games each standard user can use and install. This feature is not included in the Business or Enterprise editions of Vista.
* Windows SideShow: Enables the auxiliary displays on newer laptops or on supported Windows Mobile devices. It is meant to be used to display device gadgets while the computer is on or off.
* Speech recognition is integrated into Vista.[14] It features a redesigned user interface and configurable command-and-control commands. Unlike the Office 2003 version, which works only in Office and WordPad, Speech Recognition in Windows Vista works for any accessible application. In addition, it currently supports several languages: British and American English, Spanish, French, German, Chinese (Traditional and Simplified), and Japanese.
* New fonts, including several designed for screen reading, and improved Chinese (Yahei, JhengHei), Japanese (Meiryo) and Korean (Malgun) fonts. See Windows Vista typefaces. ClearType has also been enhanced and enabled by default.
* Problem Reports and Solutions, a control panel which allows users to view previously sent problems and any solutions or additional information that is available.
* Improved audio controls allow the system-wide volume or volume of individual audio devices and even individual applications to be controlled separately. New audio functionalities such as Room Correction, Bass Management, Speaker Fill and Headphone virtualization have also been incorporated.
* Windows System Assessment Tool is a tool used to benchmark system performance. Software such as games can retrieve this rating and modify its own behavior at runtime to improve performance. The benchmark tests CPU, RAM, 2-D and 3-D graphics acceleration, Graphics Memory and Hard disk space.[15][16]
* Windows Ultimate Extras: The Ultimate Edition of Windows Vista provides access to extra games and tools, available through Windows Update. This replaces the Microsoft Plus! software bundle that was sold alongside prior versions of Windows.
* Disk Management: A utility to modify hard disk drive partitions, including shrinking, creating and formatting new partitions.
* Performance Diagnostic Console includes various tools for tuning and monitoring system performance and resources activities of CPU, disks, network, memory and other resources. It shows the operations on files, the opened connections, etc.

I don't use some of this stuff, as you or someone else said earlier, "Third Party"... Vista is my basis

zaroba

lol. you can say its pointless all you want. you can follow what you read all you want.
my pc is proof that it does in fact show a performence increase.

you see, like you with reading stuff, i too went that path. i went threw the Microsoft Systems Engineer certification courses. what i have found is that what the books tell you IS NOT what will most often happen in real life situations.

in fact, you will most often learn completely different things via real life trial and error then the books will tell you.
so, I suggest you actually try testing stuff before claiming it as truth.

__________________

tlarkin

Intel-

How does that benefit the end user? I am talking about the end user, the average person who uses a computer.

None of those things really benefit an end user, they benefit the power users or the IT/Enterprise users.

You think your average joe is going to watch the stability monitor, or the crash reporter, or look into using NAP at home? Or perhaps the average user will encrypt their file system? The average user can't even back up their own data, remember their passwords, or figure out how to fully use an email/calendar system. I can't tell you how many passwords I reset every day at work.

None of those things really benefit anyone, because any advanced user is going to use more powerful third party apps, and the basic users aren't going to use any of that crap.

So, again, how does this benefit the end user?