Stephanie2008

Warning: You cannot really call me a noob, because that assumes I am a 'beginner', when actually I am more like 'not technologically oriented'. I understand that some of you find people like me frustrating. Not only am I basically computer illiterate, but I have not much interest attempting to become technologically oriented. I will not be building my own computer. Things that you take for granted will be over my head, so please don't assume I understand the basics. Feel free not to read further if this is a turn off to you. I understand.

Context: I have been limping along on a defective W98 HP since the time flat screen first came out, basically. Somehow, I have nursed this beast through more near-deaths than anyone can believe, on the promise that I would buy myself a gaming computer when the beast finally died. It is not cooperating with my death wishes. I've researched a new computer many times, but always managed to revive the darn thing and it seemed it was NEVER a good time to buy a computer, because there is always something coming just around the corner that will make things either better or cheaper.

However, the time is way past due for a new computer and things have deteriorated so badly that the computer is mostly an exercise of patience and frustration, alternatively.

I've spent the better part of two weeks now researching things I don't understand well and likely never will. In that research, I came across a company that gets good reviews and is reputed to be able to make basic gaming computers that compete with DYI'er prices better than anyone else (Cyber Power).

Goal: What I basically want is a solid computer that will play games well (mostly questish kinds of games, graphically intensive, not just the new ones but the ones I haven't been able to play on this beast for years now, like Icewind Dales, WoW, etc) without wasting money or becoming immediately obsolete.

The price range is basically $1000-2000'ish, I'm in the US (Alaska, though) technically, and I'll need a monitor.

However, I have some significant questions that I need to sort out first and I was hoping to tap into expertise here if people are willing to help out someone like me, knowing I will not be building. Sorry to bombard with questions, feel free to pass or pick and choose which questions appeal.

1. The first, and perhaps central dilemma, is which of three ways to go:

A. Skip SLI altogether and the know that I might need a new computer in just a few years to catch up with duo or quad or whatever the heck is to follow. Get 4 mg memory and an 8800 series video card, spend a little more to make it cool and quiet, and call it good. Something like an upgraded this: http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Gamer_Infinity_7500/

B. Buy something that is SLI ready but doesn't have it yet, with the aforementioned memory, video card, fan and cooling upgrades. Something like an upgraded this:
http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/G...y_8900_Deluxe/

C. Bite the bullet and add the SLI and second video card now. Is this overkill for me? Something like..
http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Gamer_Infinity_SLI/

Many of the other questions tie into this dilemma. Basically, I don't want to spend a lot of money -and- become immediately obsolete. One or the other, please. I can live with the idea of buying a computer that is really good for NOW and say no on the bells and whistles for the future - or spending money for future add-ons if there is a reason to believe they will actually be worth doing in the long run. I don't think I am willing to make "upgrades", though, that will mean I cannot now enjoy the games that are out there now and over the past few years that I haven't been able to enjoy, for something that may or may not happen in the future. In other words, compatibility is a big thing for me, along with future viability. I have to figure out a way to balance these two, perhaps competing, issues.

2. Vista versus XP - Right now I am leaning towards going with XP, based on the assumption that existing games are more compatible, Vista is still buggy and it is possible to play Direct 10X games with XP. Is this sound thinking?

3. How important/good is liquid cooling for people who game a lot (though not well) or leave their computers on a lot? Is there less risk of dust problems with liquid cooling? Are there risks?

4. Are there compatibility issues regarding SLI systems or SLI ready systems, i.e., with games or other software? I know that you have to go with a 64 bit OS if you use a SLI system. Does that mean I couldn't play these existing games with an SLI or SLI ready system?


I apologize in advance if these questions are silly or my dilemma inconceivable to anyone. I'm seriously hung up here, though, and I could really use some help.

Thanks so much for anyone who has gotten to the bottom of all this. I'll work on my brevity.

paratwa

For one, skip SLI. SLI is a waste of money. 1 killer 8800GT video card would be all you need for 90% of games. And if you decide that you really want SLI, then get both cards now. Because if you get 1 now, and later on you decide to get another one, you find that newer cards have come out that are faster than 2 of your cards combined.

Water cooling is for people that overclock their systems. If you are not going to be doing that, then a standard air cooled system will be fine.

XP will not technically play DX10 games in DX10 mode. They will play them in DX9. But there are a couple of games that you can hack and make them play in the high settings of DX10. You really need Vista for DX10.

No you do not need a 64bit system to SLI. 32 bit runs it very well.

And just a warning. Cyberpower has only a C rating from the Better Business Bureau.
http://www.labbb.org/BBBWeb/Forms/Bu...anyID=13080817

"Complainants allege the company sells defective merchandise, and fails to provide warranty service as agreed. Some complainants allege they receive merchandise which is inoperable or defective at the time of delivery. In other cases customers complain they return defective components two or three times for the same repair, or, repaired items are retuned without the repairs performed, in the same condition as when they were sent in for repair. Complainants are generally dissatisfied with the level of customer service provided, claiming they are unable to reach company personnel by phone, and e-mails are not responded to. Some complainants who request refunds on defective products are dissatisfied with the company's policy of deducting S & H charges from the refund amount."

tlarkin

It is never really a good time to buy unless you closely watch the market and buy right after price drops if you are looking to maximize your budget.


Never touched a Cyber Power that I can recall, so haven't dealt with them much. When it comes down to the bare performance of a gaming rig, most of it comes from the video card. So, you could feasibly get away with buying a decent prebuilt system and upgrading the video card to a nice DX10 card.

Well, building it yourself will save a few dollars in some cases and in others it won't. If you find the right Dell coupon you can't beat their prices. I don't know how Dell does it, they are taking losses to up their sales. Shipping to Alaska may be a problem, because I know some places only ship to the lower 48 states.


First off SLI is pretty much a marketing scheme and you are better off buying one high end video card than more than one of the lesser cards and putting them in SLI.

XP if you want to run those older legacy games, plus the OS is always something you can upgrade later on. I have a favorite game called Fallout 1 and Fallout 2 and they don't run in vista at all. I know the games are old and archaic, but hey they are some of my all time favorites and I still to this day love playing them.

Its not important, unless you want to seriously over clock your system; and yes you always run a risk of failure when using non standard configurations like liquid cooling. I would stick to a standard configuration and make sure your fans are built right. You basically want air sucking from the front and exhausting out the back, you want good air flow. Good air flow will be sufficient enough. I have never used water cooling in my life.

Again, SLI is a marketing scheme. To break it down for you, it basically puts two cards into parallel processing mode, so it allows more bandwidth to be processed. Now, if they had dual core GPUs they could run in what is known as distributive processing mode, and they could load balance commands. SLI is not going to give you that much performance increase but it will cost you a lot more money. There were a lot of stability problems in the beginning of SLI but now for the most part things seem stable. It is up to you if you want to spend the extra money to get a very small increase in performance. Sometimes, you don't even get an increase so its a waste of money in my opinion.

Stephanie2008

Thanks. That's the kind of thing I need to know.

Interesting. I had heard that it was for systems that ran hot because of games, but no one mentioned just over-clocked systems. Is this a terrible time for me to mention I smoke at my computer and am wondering if it would help protect my system a bit to have liquid cooling rather than fans?

Am I going to be hurting any time soon not to have DX10? Can I play older games if I have DX10/Vista easily?

Ah, see, this is where that little bit of (confused) knowledge is causing me problems. I just re-read, and it seems it is recommended for 4GM RAM systems, not SLI systems.

Ain't that just the pits? *sigh* I read all these great reviews, along with customer feedback on their site that indicated that even those who had problems ended up being very happy with their systems and the price. Hmm...any other ideas for a company?

Thanks so much for your responses!

Editted to create a typo. Apparently, this is making me go dylexic, as costumers are surely not the same as customers...

paratwa

Anything over 3.25 gigs of ram will not be seen by a 32 bit OS. To access over 3.25 you need a 64 bit OS.

If you decide on running XP, get the 32 bit OS and 2 gigs of ram would be good for it. If you get the 64bit version of Vista then 4 gigs would be good. With the 32bit version of Vista 2 gigs would be the minimum amount of ram you would want for it, since Vista is a memory hog.

I smoke at my computer as well, no problems other than you need to use some canned air to blow out the system every couple of months, but you should do that anyways since dust collects fast even if you don't smoke, and dust can lead to over heating problems.

A couple of people here on these forums have bought from Cyberpower with no problems, I just wanted to make sure you know that they don't have the best rating.

Since I always build my own systems, I really have no idea who would be a good company to buy from. Stay away from Dell and Gateway though.

Stephanie2008

Isn't that the truth?

Hm...I thought I needed something like a NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GT 512MB video card. What kind of card would be DX10? Don't I need Vista to use DX10 anyway? So confused....sorry for the probably inane questions.


The problem is, I don't want to buy from Dell. Especially now that they have out-sourced their Costumer Service to India. I have a problem with that philosophically, but also, just on a practical level, there are -enough- language barriers for me in talking about these computer issues without throwing in another. Alas, I am all too familiar with the shipping issues living up here - as well as the local choices available.

Thanks for that. You two are in agreement on this one, too, which is nice.

I do love playing games, and there's a whole list of things I've not been able to buy that I'd really like to get my hands on before moving forward. This is the incentive that keeps me slogging through all this. Fun, fun.


Okay, great. Though does liquid cooling reduce the risk of dust/smoke in the system? I know I shouldn't smoke at my computer... but I do and with 8 months of Winter, 3 cats and a 1,000 SF house, that isn't likely to change until I relocate or quit smoking.


I don't want to spend the money to get neglible or no gains. My concern is basically the future - do you think they are going to come out with GPU's that do this distributive processing mode thing you are referring to and SLI (duo or quad) is going to become a must down the road soon? I just worry about becoming obsolete, you know?

I really appreciate the help here. You have no idea how much.

Stephanie2008

Sorry for the double post, but I'm reading the dark side of Cyber Power reviews and it is beyond frightening. Back to the drawing board, it seems.

paratwa

Do you know someone that is good with computers that you would trust to build you one if you bought the parts? You could get a much better system doing it that way for your money.

Stephanie2008

Not really, but that's an avenue it looks like I might have to explore now, along with seeing what other options are available on the net and whether I can find a private business in town that might build custom computers, I guess.

Gah, it's just a lot of work in circles, isn't it? *swoon and laugh*

tlarkin

I think the next big thing in video card technology will be multiple core processors for the GPU on the video card itself. Then it can load balance and distribute as need be, and can handle a lot more at once.

I also agree, you have to know somebody who can build a computer. Its honestly not all that hard. All you do is assemble parts in a box, which are keyed or mapped anyway so its hard to install them wrong. Like you have to force it in the wrong way usually to do so. I think that loading an OS is almost harder than actually building a computer physically. Not to alter your opinions, but I think it is something to consider.