intake/exhaust fans

ChrisLaX20 · 06-22-2006, 10:37 PM

Hi all,

I don't have any problems with my computer, however my roomate does and I have a question about intake/exhaust fans on my computer.

I have 2 intake fans in the front below the hard drives on my computer, 2 on the side case, and none in the back. I have an extra fan sitting around I never installed, so I guess I am asking should I install it in the back as an exhaust fan?

Is it possible to have enough intake fans (like my case) that you just dont need exhaust fans and all the intake forces the excess air out the top? Thanks guys.

Chris
My Specs:
AMD 4000+ San Diego
ASUS A8N5X
Sapphire X800 Pro
Antec Truepower II 550W
2GB A-Data DDR 3200 RAM
Audigy 2 ZS

**The_Other_One** · 06-22-2006, 10:44 PM

Actually, from my experience when I had a case with a fan controller on it, the temps went down most when I had the exaust fan on full blast and the intake fan very low. And usually, there's a trend where companies just put exaust fans and not intake. I don't know about your side fans, though... Though I never cared for those. They divert the flow of air...

ChrisLaX20 · 06-22-2006, 10:57 PM

Ok,

I have another question, thanks for the quick response on the first one. My roomates rig is this:

4000+ San Diego
ABIT mobo
Sapphire X800 Pro
500W PSU
1 GB RAM (not sure what brand, cheap though)
1 side fan, 1 top exhaust fan

During Gaming, his screen freezes up after a while, especially in HL2 and CS:S but it also happens in Age of Empires III, Civilization, etc. He has removed the side and put a huge (like 15") house fan on full blast and it works a little while longer, but still freezes. So, he used ATI tool and underclocked his video card and made the video card fan run at 100% all the time. Worked still a little more, yet inevitably froze. I have same video card overclocked and it works like a charm, I am extremely satisfied with it. It is strange because we have exact same systems but mobo, RAM, psu, and he has a cracked version of XP, mine is an OEM home version. I think it is his XP causing these crashes, or cheap PSU. Any suggestions?

Thanks,

Chris

[-0MEGA-] · 06-22-2006, 11:17 PM

If you could tell us the temps of his CPU and GPU, it would help out alot. You can use SpeedFan for the CPU/System and ATI Tool for the video card.

I dont care for side fans either, since they interfere with the air flow. Ideally you should have intake on the front, and exhaust on the back. This way clean cooler air comes in through the front, cools down the heated computer parts, and exhausts the hot air out the back. So in your circumstance, i would remove the side fan and install either one or two fans in the back of the case as exhaust fans.

4W4K3 · 06-22-2006, 11:21 PM

Basically. Some cases have a blowhole (fan on top) that should be used as an exhaust (like a blowhole). A side panel fan is intake, test out if it does anything to drop temps, if not, remove it.

vagg · 06-22-2006, 11:33 PM

Probably best to install one on the back or get a better case.

SIMP · 06-23-2006, 08:38 PM

I agree with The_Other_One. I have fan controllers on my system with fans as follows:
2) 80mm intake fans in the lower front
1) 120mm intake on the side

1) 120mm exhaust in the rear
1) 80mm exhaust on the top

When I have more air flowing out than in, my idle case temps are around 73-74 F. When I turn the intake fans up, they seem to jump to around 76-77 F. I am running a Pentium D 805 2.66 Ghz OC'd to 3.8 Ghz and the highest temp my CPU reaches is about 59 C.

One more thing to consider, if your case has a waffle or some sort of perforated fan guard built into the case, cut or Dremel that out and install a regular wire type fan guard. It will greatly improve your airflow. Hope this helps.

Thorn3 · 06-26-2006, 12:04 AM

Hello all. I live in Arizona where the temperature is often times quite hot. Using AC is not often times a suitable solution, as utility costs can be less than appreciated. Using fans for the most part is not suitable either for several reasons. First and most importantly, most computers do not offer a reasonable amount of airflow due to internal obstructions caused by hardware and wires. It simply does not matter much that there is a fan in front and in back, or one on the side as well due to such problems. Another problem is the idea that often times, the ambient air temperature is not enough to allow suitable thermal transfer to occure at the speeds at which the air is passing over the heated surfaces. There simply is not enough time to allow proper thermal transfer due to lower air pressures inside the case.
I have found that there is a suitable solution to computer system cooling that is less expensive than one might think. I am sure you are all familiar with those electric coolers you can purchase to keep a six-pack cold. They utilize a thermo-electric cooling system that is both economical to run, takes up relatively little space and works like a charm. Coolers such as this range in size from six-pack sized, all the way up to large coolers.
What a person can do, is basically turn their computer case into a dust free, sealed refrigerator. Don't waste time with fans. All they do is pump air in and out of the system, causing a great deal of dust to accumulate which further hinders cooling, not to mention the amount of time and difficulty keeping the computer components clean for efficient thermal transfer. Not only is component placement an air flow obstruction, but it also creates eddy current all over the place in the computer housing, which creates hot pockets that don't move anywhere, even though the air flow is present elsewhere.
What I plan to do, is to seal up the computer housing and install a thermo-electric cooler in the housing wall, just as it is mounted in the six-pack cooler. Turn the computer housing into a refrigerator! No air passes from the outside to the inside, so the interior always remains clean. All thermal transfer occurs directly inside the case where it comes into contact with the thermal plate mounted in the housing wall. The fan and heat sink are on the outside of the computer housing. It is a good idea to keep some moisture absorbing packets inside the case to absorb any moisture, preventing condensation on any components. Since the system is sealed, no more moisture can enter, so the inside stays dry. There are other details to doing such a mod, but for those who have an imagination, such things are easy to see and solve. RTV is a good solution for those who wish to seal wires that lead to the outside. Not only is it a good way to seal things up, but it is not permanent either. You can peel it off when you need to change things. Foam sheet about an inch thick can be used as insulation, etc. Has anyone tried this?

sniperchang · 06-26-2006, 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thorn3

(Thorn's really long POST Above)

Sounds like your talking about something similar to water cooling, or Phase-change cooling (Wich is how a freezer does it, more info). Although you have a good point, and these are real great ideals for cooling, the reason most people don't buy them is because it's too costly. I mean fans are crappier, but they still work fine.

4W4K3 · 06-26-2006, 07:38 PM

If you can properly build a computer you won't have "obstructions" caused by wires or mis-placed hardware. More than likely you are describing a manufactured computer that is just slapped together.

The cost of maintenance and replacing hardware for a water cooling system. peltier system, phase change system is enormouse compared to air cooling. A decent phase change setup can run you ~$600, other higher ned systems are upwards of $1000. Not many people are going to spend that much when they can just do some wire management and blow out there PC cases once every few months.

What will you do when you need to open the case again? Surely the case cannot stay closed forever, I mean unless you never plan to upgrade it and expect 0 problems from it until it dies (unlikely). You'd have to re-seal it and wait a good while before you start it back up, as opening it will allow moisture and dust and "normal" air to come in.

I live in Texas, it is usually ~90F-100F+ in the summer for weeks/months on end, and I can still maintain a 35C processor temperature from my computer with simple 80mm case fans. I use a solid copper heatsink and turbine/water wheel designed CPU fan, cost ~$40. I blow out my PC with a leaf blower about every 2 months to keep it dust free. Not sure why you would need something so expensive and maintenance heavy just to keep the PC cool...?

06-22-2006, 10:37 PM	#1 (permalink)
ChrisLaX20 New Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 5	intake/exhaust fans Hi all, I don't have any problems with my computer, however my roomate does and I have a question about intake/exhaust fans on my computer. I have 2 intake fans in the front below the hard drives on my computer, 2 on the side case, and none in the back. I have an extra fan sitting around I never installed, so I guess I am asking should I install it in the back as an exhaust fan? Is it possible to have enough intake fans (like my case) that you just dont need exhaust fans and all the intake forces the excess air out the top? Thanks guys. Chris My Specs: AMD 4000+ San Diego ASUS A8N5X Sapphire X800 Pro Antec Truepower II 550W 2GB A-Data DDR 3200 RAM Audigy 2 ZS

06-22-2006, 10:44 PM	#2 (permalink)
The_Other_One Super Moderator Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Lexington, NC Age: 23 Posts: 12,368	Actually, from my experience when I had a case with a fan controller on it, the temps went down most when I had the exaust fan on full blast and the intake fan very low. And usually, there's a trend where companies just put exaust fans and not intake. I don't know about your side fans, though... Though I never cared for those. They divert the flow of air... __________________ Desktop * Athlon X2 4200 \| 2G RAM \| 160G HD \| 7600GT Laptop1 * C2D T5550 \| 3G RAM \| 120G HD \| Intel x3100 Laptop2 * C2D T5250 \| 2G RAM \| 160G HD \| Intel x3100

06-22-2006, 11:21 PM	#5 (permalink)
4W4K3 VIP Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Lewisville, TX Age: 20 Posts: 6,875	Basically. Some cases have a blowhole (fan on top) that should be used as an exhaust (like a blowhole). A side panel fan is intake, test out if it does anything to drop temps, if not, remove it. __________________ My Computer I choose to believe what I was programmed to believe. Can I eat your brain? FOLDING FOR THE GOOD OF MANKIND :F@H Team 44358

06-23-2006, 08:38 PM	#7 (permalink)
SIMP Silver Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Mississippi Posts: 246	I agree with The_Other_One. I have fan controllers on my system with fans as follows: 2) 80mm intake fans in the lower front 1) 120mm intake on the side 1) 120mm exhaust in the rear 1) 80mm exhaust on the top When I have more air flowing out than in, my idle case temps are around 73-74 F. When I turn the intake fans up, they seem to jump to around 76-77 F. I am running a Pentium D 805 2.66 Ghz OC'd to 3.8 Ghz and the highest temp my CPU reaches is about 59 C. One more thing to consider, if your case has a waffle or some sort of perforated fan guard built into the case, cut or Dremel that out and install a regular wire type fan guard. It will greatly improve your airflow. Hope this helps. __________________ Main PC (Custom Build): E2160 @ 2.8GHz / MSI Neo2-FR / 7800 GTX / 4GB DDR2-800 / Vista Ultimate Guest PC (Compaq Presario): AMD 64 3800+ / Stock Mobo / 6150SE / 2GB DDR2-667 / Vista Home Basic

06-26-2006, 07:38 PM	#10 (permalink)
4W4K3 VIP Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Lewisville, TX Age: 20 Posts: 6,875	If you can properly build a computer you won't have "obstructions" caused by wires or mis-placed hardware. More than likely you are describing a manufactured computer that is just slapped together. The cost of maintenance and replacing hardware for a water cooling system. peltier system, phase change system is enormouse compared to air cooling. A decent phase change setup can run you ~$600, other higher ned systems are upwards of $1000. Not many people are going to spend that much when they can just do some wire management and blow out there PC cases once every few months. What will you do when you need to open the case again? Surely the case cannot stay closed forever, I mean unless you never plan to upgrade it and expect 0 problems from it until it dies (unlikely). You'd have to re-seal it and wait a good while before you start it back up, as opening it will allow moisture and dust and "normal" air to come in. I live in Texas, it is usually ~90F-100F+ in the summer for weeks/months on end, and I can still maintain a 35C processor temperature from my computer with simple 80mm case fans. I use a solid copper heatsink and turbine/water wheel designed CPU fan, cost ~$40. I blow out my PC with a leaf blower about every 2 months to keep it dust free. Not sure why you would need something so expensive and maintenance heavy just to keep the PC cool...? __________________ My Computer I choose to believe what I was programmed to believe. Can I eat your brain? FOLDING FOR THE GOOD OF MANKIND :F@H Team 44358

06-22-2006, 10:57 PM	#3 (permalink)
ChrisLaX20 New Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 5	Ok, I have another question, thanks for the quick response on the first one. My roomates rig is this: 4000+ San Diego ABIT mobo Sapphire X800 Pro 500W PSU 1 GB RAM (not sure what brand, cheap though) 1 side fan, 1 top exhaust fan During Gaming, his screen freezes up after a while, especially in HL2 and CS:S but it also happens in Age of Empires III, Civilization, etc. He has removed the side and put a huge (like 15") house fan on full blast and it works a little while longer, but still freezes. So, he used ATI tool and underclocked his video card and made the video card fan run at 100% all the time. Worked still a little more, yet inevitably froze. I have same video card overclocked and it works like a charm, I am extremely satisfied with it. It is strange because we have exact same systems but mobo, RAM, psu, and he has a cracked version of XP, mine is an OEM home version. I think it is his XP causing these crashes, or cheap PSU. Any suggestions? Thanks, Chris

06-22-2006, 11:17 PM	#4 (permalink)
[-0MEGA-] Diamond Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Concord, NH Age: 20 Posts: 27,082	If you could tell us the temps of his CPU and GPU, it would help out alot. You can use SpeedFan for the CPU/System and ATI Tool for the video card. I dont care for side fans either, since they interfere with the air flow. Ideally you should have intake on the front, and exhaust on the back. This way clean cooler air comes in through the front, cools down the heated computer parts, and exhausts the hot air out the back. So in your circumstance, i would remove the side fan and install either one or two fans in the back of the case as exhaust fans.

06-22-2006, 11:33 PM	#6 (permalink)
vagg Bronze Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 47	Probably best to install one on the back or get a better case.

06-26-2006, 12:04 AM	#8 (permalink)
Thorn3 New Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Arizona Posts: 5	Hello all. I live in Arizona where the temperature is often times quite hot. Using AC is not often times a suitable solution, as utility costs can be less than appreciated. Using fans for the most part is not suitable either for several reasons. First and most importantly, most computers do not offer a reasonable amount of airflow due to internal obstructions caused by hardware and wires. It simply does not matter much that there is a fan in front and in back, or one on the side as well due to such problems. Another problem is the idea that often times, the ambient air temperature is not enough to allow suitable thermal transfer to occure at the speeds at which the air is passing over the heated surfaces. There simply is not enough time to allow proper thermal transfer due to lower air pressures inside the case. I have found that there is a suitable solution to computer system cooling that is less expensive than one might think. I am sure you are all familiar with those electric coolers you can purchase to keep a six-pack cold. They utilize a thermo-electric cooling system that is both economical to run, takes up relatively little space and works like a charm. Coolers such as this range in size from six-pack sized, all the way up to large coolers. What a person can do, is basically turn their computer case into a dust free, sealed refrigerator. Don't waste time with fans. All they do is pump air in and out of the system, causing a great deal of dust to accumulate which further hinders cooling, not to mention the amount of time and difficulty keeping the computer components clean for efficient thermal transfer. Not only is component placement an air flow obstruction, but it also creates eddy current all over the place in the computer housing, which creates hot pockets that don't move anywhere, even though the air flow is present elsewhere. What I plan to do, is to seal up the computer housing and install a thermo-electric cooler in the housing wall, just as it is mounted in the six-pack cooler. Turn the computer housing into a refrigerator! No air passes from the outside to the inside, so the interior always remains clean. All thermal transfer occurs directly inside the case where it comes into contact with the thermal plate mounted in the housing wall. The fan and heat sink are on the outside of the computer housing. It is a good idea to keep some moisture absorbing packets inside the case to absorb any moisture, preventing condensation on any components. Since the system is sealed, no more moisture can enter, so the inside stays dry. There are other details to doing such a mod, but for those who have an imagination, such things are easy to see and solve. RTV is a good solution for those who wish to seal wires that lead to the outside. Not only is it a good way to seal things up, but it is not permanent either. You can peel it off when you need to change things. Foam sheet about an inch thick can be used as insulation, etc. Has anyone tried this?

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