I Have made a Decision, What do you all think?

**Praetor** · 07-18-2004, 12:42 AM

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While the Geforce 6800 is a great card, any of the x800 series outperforms the 6800, look at the benchmarks. the 6800 may be better with low resolution, tell me wut gamer uses 800X600 unless they have to. the x800 performs better at high resolutions, which is great!

I see we have a fanboy .... might i remind you if you visit nvidia's website you'll see benchmarks noting the exact opposite .... so much for benchmarks. In case you havnt realized it yet, benchmarks dont mean shit, both ATi and nVidia have benchmarks that indicate their company's point. Sides 00 you're comparing the top end cardm the X800, against the bottom end card, the 6800. Now if you did a proper comparison, it would be X300 vs 6800

Viper_86 · 07-18-2004, 12:52 AM

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Originally Posted by Praetor

Sides 00 you're comparing the top end cardm the X800, against the bottom end card, the 6800. Now if you did a proper comparison, it would be X300 vs 6800

well im sry but i like doing the top end cards of each company...thats how i decide what ill get, i get what is better obviously. its true that i have always liked ati's over nvidia's, ive had plenty of both and ati's cards have always satisfied me more. and you keep saying that the 6800 is the better card but then ask y i dont do a more fair comparison with the x300 vs the 6800, but if the 6800 was better than the x800 it would be a fair comparison. and im not saying that nvidia has a bad card, they're great, i just prefer having ati's cards.

**Praetor** · 07-18-2004, 01:29 AM

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well im sry but I like doing the top end cards of each company...thats how I decide what ill get, I get what is better obviously.

In that case, the comparison should be between the X800 and the 6800U

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and you keep saying that the 6800 is the better card but then ask y I dont do a more fair comparison with the x300 vs the 6800, but if the 6800 was better than the x800 it would be a fair comparison. and im not saying that nvidia has a bad card, they're great, I just prefer having ati's cards.

Yes! But your comparisons are worthless because you comparing a top end card to a low end car -- SURE... you're right but the results arent useful... let's just say for argument sake that the X800 is better than the 6800 ... ir would be quite a shock to see the X800 not beat the 6800 considering the you're comparing the top versus the bottom.

Edit: just to be comapring the 6800 to the X800 speaks volumes about the 6800 as it is

Viper_86 · 07-18-2004, 05:15 AM

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Originally Posted by Praetor

In that case, the comparison should be between the X800 and the 6800U

ok...ill take a look at the 6800U, havent heard anything or even of it till now. unless thats the nvidias newest card, which i thot was the 6800...so if the 6800U is nvidias newest card and the 6800 is older lower end card, then my comparison stand for the x800 vs the 6800U. ill look around at the 6800U a bit.

**Praetor** · 07-18-2004, 05:24 AM

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ok...ill take a look at the 6800U, havent heard anything or even of it till now. unless thats the nvidias newest card, which I thot was the 6800...so if the 6800U is nvidias newest card and the 6800 is older lower end card, then my comparison stand for the x800 vs the 6800U. ill look around at the 6800U a bit.

Kewl ... I havnt had much time to examine nVidia's product line much but as I understand it, they are structured as:
- Baseline: GF6800
- Midrange: GF6800GT
- Premium: GF6800U
Of course with variants amoung each "class" of cards. The ATi lineup looks like
- Baseline: X300
- Midrange: X600
- Premium: X800
Again with variants amoung each class.

Without debating which cards are faster than which because you and i both know that's a pointless pissing contest and both companies can make benchmarks that contrast with each other ... and unfortunately, Tom's cant be a trusted as an unbiased reviewer anymore (not for me at least, even though their bias agrees with my preference ... it's unprofessional .. but that's another rant). The bottom line is that benchmarks give a general idea -- the specific numbers are really irellevent unless one wants to get into pissing contests (which i'm not gonna do) .... it's more useful to look at trends and patterns with those numbers. Which raises an interesting point:

About Pixel Shader 3.0, currently an "nVidia only" kinda deal, there IS an improvement and a NOTICEABLE one at that (i was argueing with my friend, an ATI fan until he showed me otherwise). To be honest if there is an improvement on graphical quality, it's wasted on me as both Pixel Shader 2.0 and 3.0 look fabulous. The difference however is that the 6800-series perform shockingly better when making use of Pixel Shader 3.0 (i was expecting a frame here or there but there were some very significant improvements). A very interesting time for game developers!

Viper_86 · 07-18-2004, 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Praetor

About Pixel Shader 3.0, currently an "nVidia only" kinda deal, there IS an improvement and a NOTICEABLE one at that (i was argueing with my friend, an ATI fan until he showed me otherwise). To be honest if there is an improvement on graphical quality, it's wasted on me as both Pixel Shader 2.0 and 3.0 look fabulous. The difference however is that the 6800-series perform shockingly better when making use of Pixel Shader 3.0 (i was expecting a frame here or there but there were some very significant improvements). A very interesting time for game developers!

i agree...nvidia does have ati beat with the pixel shading hands down. in my opinion tho ati has nvidia beat overall. but i dont no how things r gonna turn out once nvidia releases its new card, the Nvidia sli, which is gonna b a kick ass card! ofcourse i dont expect ati to just stand by and watch, but if they let nvidia once again take the lead in visual performance and power, i just might go back to nvidia, that is till ati hits back ;-p i dont think u really said wut card u prefer, just a lot of defending the nvidia 6800U, whicch is a great card...b even better if it didnt use so much freakin power.

or the does the ati even have pixel shading???

**Praetor** · 07-18-2004, 06:14 AM

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i dont think u really said wut card u prefer, just a lot of defending the nvidia 6800U, whicch is a great card...b even better if it didnt use so much freakin power

I'm an nVidia fan... not because of performance....not becuase of drivers .... not even because i like badass ultra loud fans ... but because I've bought 4 ATi cards in my life ... 3 of those times I open the box and that's not the card i paid for. I'm not going through that again period.

I'm not so much the type to bounce from company to company based on performance or nothing but when i "trust" a label or a brand, I'll stick with it until i get burned.

Edit:

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or the does the ati even have pixel shading???

The ATi cards support Pixel Shader 2.0 ... I was quite shocked myself to see that they didnt "step up" and offer Pixel Shader 3.0 considering that the generation old 9800s have Pixel Shader 2.0

Viper_86 · 07-18-2004, 06:34 AM

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Originally Posted by Praetor

I'm not so much the type to bounce from company to company based on performance or nothing but when i "trust" a label or a brand, I'll stick with it until i get burned.

i like to go with the card that performs the best, which l8ly has been ati...but i havent been following the hardware part of computers till about 5 or so years ago...which isnt all that long to some1 whoes been in2 that stuff their whole lives.and seeing that i havent bought any cards myself until the 9800 pro just recently,..well my dad was the one who actually bought it for hus computer but i was there...i havent had any problems with the product at all, and wut a great difference it made goin from the nvidia...somewhere around the 5200 or someting...i dont no many models that nvidia has other than the more recent ones...anyway...that was a pos card...it was like 3 or so yrs old. dont worry im not even thinkin about comparing the 9800 pro to any of the nvidias 5000 series. my computer that i recently own is a hunk of shit, stupid emachine. its specs r freakin stone age...not 3.1 or even dos era, but its a 450 mhz celeron with a 4.02 hd!!!! OUCH it came with 32 mb of ram till i bought a stick of 128 coz my games werent workin to well on it, and now none of my games would probably even recognize that its an actual computer

this is y im saving up for a new machine, our dell doesnt quite cut it gaming wise, not my dads puter...which is miuch better..only has better vid card and more ram. haha i have no idea how i even got started on talking about this...o well

**Praetor** · 07-18-2004, 06:40 AM

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dont worry im not even thinkin about comparing the 9800 pro to any of the nvidias 5000 series. my computer that I recently own is a hunk of shit, stupid emachine

The 5200 is a piece of junk. The 5500-5700 are good cards for their money. The 5800 was a marketing disaster even though it was a very advanced chip. The 59x0 chips will take that 9800Pro quite evenly.

Nephilim · 07-18-2004, 06:49 AM

Oh, Lordy do we have a benchmark war going or what? Benchmarks are a rough guide as to how a card will perform not concrete evidence.

Even if benchmarks really mattered, in every single one of the many reviews I've read on both top-o-the line cards from ATI and nVidia are running neck and neck in almost every benchmark. Neither card is a runaway winner, simple as that.

Has anyone here bought both cards and tested them side by side? If someone has, I'd recommend listening to them.

Does the nVidia look nice to you? Then buy it. Does the ATI appeal to you more? Then buy it. Both companies offer such close performance in each price bracket it's a moot point to argue that one is way better than the other.

As for the pixel shader 2.0/3.0 arguement I ask myself one question - Am I playing a shooter to stop and look at the trees to see if I can notice that much of a difference in the leaves? Nope. I'm there to slaughter everything I can as fast as I can so leaves that look just a bit prettier aren't that big of a deal to me.

A little less benchmarksturbation and a little more real life would help those wondering what to get

07-18-2004, 06:49 AM	#60 (permalink)
Nephilim VIP Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Phoenix, AZ Age: 36 Posts: 166	Oh, Lordy do we have a benchmark war going or what? Benchmarks are a rough guide as to how a card will perform not concrete evidence. Even if benchmarks really mattered, in every single one of the many reviews I've read on both top-o-the line cards from ATI and nVidia are running neck and neck in almost every benchmark. Neither card is a runaway winner, simple as that. Has anyone here bought both cards and tested them side by side? If someone has, I'd recommend listening to them. Does the nVidia look nice to you? Then buy it. Does the ATI appeal to you more? Then buy it. Both companies offer such close performance in each price bracket it's a moot point to argue that one is way better than the other. As for the pixel shader 2.0/3.0 arguement I ask myself one question - Am I playing a shooter to stop and look at the trees to see if I can notice that much of a difference in the leaves? Nope. I'm there to slaughter everything I can as fast as I can so leaves that look just a bit prettier aren't that big of a deal to me. A little less benchmarksturbation and a little more real life would help those wondering what to get __________________ P4 3.06 Ghz / Gigabyte GA-8INXP 1024 MB Mushkin PC2100 Sapphire Radeon 9800 Pro Lite-On LTD-166S / Plextor Premium / Plextor PX-708A "And there we saw the giants ... And we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight." Numbers 13:33

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