integrated vs radeon 5450

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iameatingjam

New Member
I recently purchased a new acer slimline pc ( AX3950 EW10P), for a good deal. I didn't think about how limited my choice for video cards were, but I'm not that hardcore of a gamer so I decided to not upgrade my power supply and settle for a lower end diamond radeon HD 5450 as it will fit in my case and work safely with my 220w power supply.

I definitely wasn't expecting much, but according to windows experience index my graphics (desktop performance) rating actually went down from 4.7 to 4.4, although gaming graphics went from 4.0 to 6.0. I'm aware I know WEI isn't exactly an accurate measure of components, but I'd like to know if there's any chance I just performed a downgrade, even for desktop performance (which I will use more than games).

I honestly don't know for sure what kind of integrated chip comes with my computer, everywhere I look it just says "intel GMA HD", although imagine its not very good.

Is the radeon 5450 actually going to improve my overall performance? Or is the difference so small I should try and return the card? Maybe a better card that would work on 220w power supply?
 
Any graphics card is going to need at least a 300w power supply, and it being a 220w OEM power supply in a small slimline case, the actual power output at load would be much less, since it would be producing a lot of heat.
 
I don't think thats necessarily true, you're forgetting that the slimline computers have very power efficient parts, and my 5450 is the only addition I've added. The 5450 uses maximum 19 watts, 9 more than onboard.

I've heard and seen many radeon 5570s workings on 220 watt power supplies, infact I have one ( not low profile) which I could have run without the case but I want to be extra careful.

I did a power consumption calculator, that recommended with every component including my motherboard/cpu/ram/fans/usb/hd/dvd drive and the 5450, 205 watts.

I'm pretty darn sure power isn't a problem. I'm more concerned about its actual processing power in everyday tasks compared to a modern integrated chip.
 
Claptonman knows his stuff better than almost anyone on this forum. I'd listen to him.

Yeah it says you need 205 watts but your PSU probably isn't pushing out that much.
 
Denther said:
Claptonman knows his stuff better than almost anyone on this forum. I'd listen to him.

Yeah it says you need 205 watts but your PSU probably isn't pushing out that much.
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:confused: Me? I know some, I would absolutely not say better than most people. Not at all.

And the issue is not that it's not going to run it, its that in time, it will deteriorate the power supply and fail.

http://www.guru3d.com/article/radeon-5450-review/6
Total system usage in watts under load: 177w

The power supply is rated at 220w peak power output. (peak as in the highest power output it got throughout all the testing) It is not putting out 220w continuously. That is under test conditions at about 30c-40c. Your computer is not going to be running at test conditions in that small case. Smaller case = more heat.

It is up to you, and the 5450 is the safest option, but just a warning. A failed PSU could take out the graphics card along with the rest of your system.
 
Our test system is a power hungry Core i7 965 / X58 based and overclocked to 3.75 GHz. Next to that we have energy saving functions disabled for this motherboard and processor (to ensure consistent benchmark results).

Our motherboard also allows adding power phases for stability, which we enabled as well. I'd say on average we are using roughly 50 to 100 Watts more than a standard PC due to these settings and then add the CPU overclock, water-cooling, additional cold cathode lights etc.
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I don't understand, aren't I still only using 9 watts more than I would be with otherwise?? I definitely don't want to risk anything but I was under the impression I was safe.
 
Its not the watts that matter so much as the distribution of amps. Very different concept.

A 220W PSU is not sufficient for any PCIe graphics card. You need a quality branded PSU with at least 26A on the 12V rail.
 
bigfella said:
A 220W PSU is not sufficient for any PCIe graphics card. You need a quality branded PSU with at least 26A on the 12V rail.
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Yeah I agree. One of my mates was wanting me to build a gaming PC on the cheap - very on the cheap, £60 for the whole thing. I sold him my old HP dx2200 microtower PC for £30 and got him a second hand XFX 9600 GT 384MB from eBay. Didn't bother to upgrade the PSU (because it was out of his budget), hooked it all up and it worked well until about a month later when the power supply died. I warned him about it but he didn't listen. I told him to upgrade that PSU as soon as possible but he thought it'd be fine. So you can learn from my experience, you need a good PSU. It was a 420W PSU with something like 16A or 18A to the +12V rail IIRC - crap PSU. I imagine that 9600 GT is also now dead. Shame, as I thought for £30 it was pretty much a steal.

OEM power supplies are what I'd call "doorstop PSUs", they're only designed to power a low-end motherboard, a CPU, one or two hard drives and one optical drive, and that's about it, so if you're going to add a graphics card, definitely upgrade the PSU. 220W is not going to be anywhere near enough to power a graphics card, not even one as low end as a 5450, because that PSU will produce nowhere near enough amps on the +12V rail.

And yes, it's more about the amps than the watts. You can have a 1000W PSU and think you're going to be totally safe, but if it only outputs 18A on the +12V rail, it's not going to power much.

If you want my recommendation for a low-cost, quality PSU, the Corsair CX430 gets my recommendation.
 
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well **** if I knew I had to upgrade my psu anyway I would have waited and got a better card. Where can I look for a good psu that will fit in my slimline case?
 
iameatingjam said:
Where can I look for a good psu that will fit in my slimline case?
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It's going to be a challenge to find a quality PSU that fits in a slimline case. These OEM slimline desktops really aren't meant to be upgraded that much I'm afraid. :(
 
claptonman said:
I believe Bigfella recommended one of these in a thread a while back with another slimline case:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817338082
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817338081

Not sure which one would fit your case.

Not the best compared to a desktop PSU, but its way better than the one you got.

And yeah, sorry, its going to be an expensive upgrade.
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those also only have 16 volts on the 12v rail, which is apparently what needs to be improved?

the case case, power supply etc upgrades are exactly what I didn't want to do.

If anyone is interested in the question I first posted, after some tests I conclude that the 5450 is significantly better than integrated with desktop and gaming graphics. Integrated struggles to play 1080p video with a second display performing another task, while it doesn't present a problem to the 5450.
 
iameatingjam said:
those also only have 16 volts on the 12v rail, which is apparently what needs to be improved?

the case case, power supply etc upgrades are exactly what I didn't want to do.

If anyone is interested in the question I first posted, after some tests I conclude that the 5450 is significantly better than integrated with desktop and gaming graphics. Integrated struggles to play 1080p video with a second display performing another task, while it doesn't present a problem to the 5450.
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Have another look mate, it has 2 x 12V rails at 16A.

Leave your current psu in there at your own (silly) risk.
 
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