Shut off suddenly to a blue screen -- is this bad?

Hey Spirit,
Thanks for the reply.

Yea, that's 'exactly' what I had thought at first too! It was then that I could no longer run any programs on the hard drive. It was worse than bad sectors. At least with bad sectors, you can still use 'some' of the data, but with this HD, I couldn't use ANY of it: I couldn't install any programs on it.

It was then that I scrapped this HD -- that is why I now have a different one in the computer now!!

So spirit, let's just say for a moment that you are right -- what are the symptoms that would appear from a bad HD? What about from bad sectors?

voyagerfan99,
good to hear from you.

voyagerfan99,
XP isn;t supported in another 413 days.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info -- that's good to know. Though I knew that XP's day were numbered. And in this case, literally. In fact, this is such an exact calculation that it has to be true. Well, at least XP still has another year. You know, Vista and W7/8 are such memory hogs, its really a shame you know.

Maybe your right, there is the possiblity that overheating IS an issue.
Yesterday, my computer turned off by itself 4 times.
I have had no blue screens at all for some time.
I considered your possiblility and so I tested it:

As soon as my computer shut off, I turned it back on and checked the temp --
It read 38 degrees.

But I heard that the overheating temperature degree is based on the CPU chip that is in the computer.
Could it be that finding out the name of this could determine what the temperature range for this is?

So what do you think it is -- the video card, or the board?

Captain Kirk
USS Enterprise
 
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Symptoms of a bad hard drive? Pretty much exactly what you were experiencing: random shut downs, crashes, inability to install programs, inability to successfully move/copy data and stuff like that. You can usually tell when a HDD is dying too because it may be making a loud clicking sound. Symptoms of bad sectors would be the same sort of thing.

The problem could be overheating. More likely your GPU is overheating than your CPU if your CPU is idle at 38C. Can you download GPU Temp and let us know what temperature your GPU is running at? http://www.gputemp.com/

Have you tried taking a can of compressed air to this system? Blow out the dust in order to reduce the temperature.
 
Okedokey,
then you should update the chipset and battery control drivers from the manufacture.
Click to expand...

I didn't know you COULD update the chipset -- is this the PSU, microchip, processor?

I never heard of battery control drivers.
Is this possible?
I thought this was a "plug and play device"?

spirit,
These are the exact problems that were happening.
However, as far as the shutting off suddenly goes though, this was happening with HD #1;
yet when I switched to HD #2, the shutting off suddenly did not change.

There was no difference!

HD #1: inability to install programs, inability to successfully move/copy data
HD #2: functions normally. No problems at all!!!

It is a laptop, so I cannot exactly blow it out with air.

I heard that your only supposed to use compressed air for keyboards and fans.

And as far as the GPU temp, I'm getting that now.
I'll keep you updated with the information tomorrow.

voyagerfan99,
Yea, I just checked, and noticed that myself!
You were close though.

Captain Kirk
USS Enterprise
 
spirit,
How you doing?

Okay, I found out about the GPU information.
I got the program, and installed it.

I ran the program several times.
And each time that I ran the program, I got the same error message.

The error message read as follows:
"The application failed to initialize properly"

It could be because I have a laptop which does not really have a 3D card, though it does have 3D capability, but it might be built into the board.
I have never fully taken apart a laptop yet, so I have not be able to analyze its composition.
However, things like sound cards or such components, I have heard that they are directly built INTO the board itself.
I am not really familiar with the Laptop Hardware arrangement.

But I do know that in Destops, that 3D cards are a separate card from the mobo.

Captain Kirk
USS Enterprise
 
You can blow the laptop out with air. Hold it up, and spray the air in the vents. So long as the air hasn't moisturized then it's fine to spray it inside the system.

And you can update the chipset driver by going into device manager, finding it in there and updating the software.

What I want to know is why are you trying to keep a system this old running? You're probably wasting your time and money. Sounds like it doesn't even run with XP properly. Must be ancient?
 
spirit:)
Hello there again. Made it back.

Looking at the fan, I didn't see ANY dust, which I thought a bit unusual.
Especially as you referred to the computer: that it was ancient.
I have seen many desktops, and they ALWAYS have dust on them.
But then again -- it could be that you can open them up further, so you can see more.
And maybe because desktop fans are bigger...

However, I am not familiar with laptop fans on the other hand.
And so I cannot know what to expect, or even if this is common.
It also seems like you mostly only know about desktops yourself.
However, it may be possible that you have dabbled into the hardware of laptops.
And might possibly know about this.

Anyways, I blew out the fan with compressed air, holding it up as you said:
The fan facing down and the laptop facing up.
Also, I found another vent on the laptop.
So I stuck the hose through the plastic grates into the core of the computer and blew it out.

Can I update the chipset driver with another computer that has internet connection (like in a file form maybe)?

As you know my other computer just died (the Compaq Evo) and I'm still in mourning over it.
This computer is my friends and I am borrowing it.
If possible, I hope to fix or for them, or at the very least, to hold me over until I can get another one.
At the moment, I cannot get another computer.

I guess you could say that I am wasting my time, but if it is possible to fix it, or, failing that,
to even pinpoint the problem so that I can better preserve it, and note what needs to be replaced --
then that is the least I can do for a friend.
Besides, they're letting me use it.

It runs just fine with XP.
It has never had any problems with the OS.
I don't know what you mean by

spirit
Sounds like it doesn't even run with XP properly.
Click to expand...
Maybe you can enlighten me as to what gave you this impression!

And as far as the "ancient" part.
I'm not quite sure about all that!
But what I do know is that my friend just got it, so it was new to him (though it was in used condition).
And has only used it once or twice:eek:

So now you can see why I am wondering about the state/problem of the computer, as this is the condition that my friend got it in...

Captain Kirk
USS Enterprise
 
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Well comon' Kirk, we found out earlier that you couldn't even get a graphics card driver which worked properly with or fully supported XP. The latest supported operating system was Me wasn't it? Must be old if there aren't even any proper graphics drivers for XP.

Didn't realise it's a friend's computer. I'm getting a bit lost in this thread now - can you tell me exactly what you've done to try and rectify the problem? I believe you've put a new hard drive in and you're still getting problems? Tried checking the RAM with Memtest86?

And yes you can download the chipset driver from the manufacturer's website on another computer and copy it across using USB or a CD and install it.

And yes it's true that I prefer desktops to laptops and I know more about them. Don't think I don't now anything about laptops though.

If you think the problem is graphics-related it could be because of the drivers (like I said, ATI doesn't officially support XP, though the 2000 drivers may work) or because the GPU itself is overheating and may need some new paste or re-soldering. In which case, you have to ask yourself - is it worth the time?
 
Hello.Spirit,

Yes I knew that the computer had been around for a while, but what I meant was, for my friend who had just got it, it was new -- as they had never used it.
And not some computer that you have had around for years. That is what I meant: new to them, not referring to the date of manufacture.

Yes, checking the RAM. That is a good idea, and I had considered it. However, I also realized that I would not be able to complete an accurate RAM test unless I was able to leave the computer running for 1 full day. And, as the computer shuts off by itself after a couple of hours, sometimes up to 4 times a day, I cannot see how a full or accurate RAM test can be completed or run!!!

I installed the W2000 ati video driver, blew it out with air, replaced the HD, checked the event viewer logs, ran the blue screen error program that notes the minidump section, ran the speccy hardware analsis program to find the temp, went to the intel site to check the temp chart for PSU's, and looked at what the blue screen error message number meant at microsoft.

As far as the Driver Chipset, there are 1,500 results. So it may take me several hours to find it.

Captain Kirk
USS Enterprise
 
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What's the exact make and model number of the laptop?

How many sticks of RAM are currently installed in the machine? If there's more than one, remove one and try using the laptop with one stick installed. Do you get the same problems? If you, remove that stick, and try the other one, or try putting the stick in a different RAM bay.

Right now though I think the issue is either your power supply/source or the motherboard is just on its last legs.
 
This is an out of control computer!

Spirit:cool:
Hi there!:D:D:D:D

Model:
Dell Inspirion 5000e

Motherboard:
Compal Electronics, Inc. 440BX Desktop Reference Platform

CPU:
Intel Pentium III E
Coppermine 0.18um Technology

Is this what you needed, or did I fail to include something?
I know that there is one more peice of information, but it can only be seen when the computer firsts starts up, and since it is a long number, it is hard to write down and takes booting it several times to get the whole thing.

TEST #1
Took out 1st Ram card.
Loaded, no problems.

TEST #2
Took out 2nd Ram card.
Did 7 test runs, all with the same result:
Test Results:
There was black screen.
Windows did not load.
No words or splash screen ever appeared on the screen.
Then suddenly, the computer just turned off after 15 seconds of being on.
In fact, it kept doing it.
Okay, that is enough tests now.
So I turned it off, but it turned itself back on:o
And resumed its own tests without me being able to stop it:confused:
The computer completed tests #8,9,10,and #11 by itself:eek:
I could not stop the computer: I kept turning it off 5 times:eek:
But it turned itself back on:eek:
So I unplugged it: "Ha, that ought to work!!"
But no, the computer kept turning on, 11,12,13,and 14 times:eek:
This is crazy, the computer is just going by itself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I took out the rechargeable battery.
[And let out a sigh of relief]:good:

Spirit, your a genuis!!!
It looks like the problem might be the RAM!!

Captain Kirk
USS Enterprise
 
Yeah it could have been bad RAM but the fact that it keeps turning itself on by itself when you unplug the power cord would be because of a dying motherboard, sorry. :(

I had an IBM laptop once that did the same sort of thing. Eventually it just died altogether and wouldn't even turn on.
 
Spirit,
How's your day going?

When I discovered the results of the RAM test, I was just about to throw away the defective RAM stick.
But then I thought to myself, "that's what a hardware novice would do".
An amatuer with hardware would automatically assume the problem to be with the first found thing.
A hardware expert would complete ALL of the tests.
And from this, "then" come to a conclusion based on all the facts.

I just realized that like they say in quantum physics, "the observer, by observing the experiement, can alter the results of the experiement".
Which, in this case would be that the RAM may have been put back into the socket wrong.
This means that all of the RAM sticks may have been correctly seated "before" the experiement took place.
And that, the socket finger release buttons may be loose or bent, which had caused the RAM stick to be seated incorrectly.

Therefore, I cannot truely say that I have COMPLETED the RAM test until I have individually tested each of the RAM sticks one at time, putting them into each socket by themselves, to not only test the RAM sticks, but to also test the sockets.

It was during this time of consideration that after realizing that during the RAM test, that I may have incorrectly seated the RAM, that it might not be the RAM that is bad, but instead that the socket itself is bad!! Huh -- I hadn't thought of that before.

And as to the "driver chipset update", I found the correct computer model at the Dell site, but I'm not quite sure what you are talking about.
By the "driver chipset update", are you referring to the Bios update?
When you say the "driver chipset update", what are you referring to?

Captain Kirk
USS Enterprise
 
Seriously that computer is so old you're wasting your time. Its called lifetime. It could even be the cpu going. It may be something you have already tested that shows an intermittent fault. Time for a new one.
 
Okedokey,

So you've narrowed the problem down to either the CPU, the mobo, or the RAM?

I suspect its the mobo as the culprit.
But just so I know in the future, what would be the symtoms of a failing CPU?

And, for future reference, I was wondering if you could help me figure out what you meant by the "driver chipset update", because I went to intel and found the correct model and make of my computer but I did no see ANY listings of what you call "driver chipset update"!
The closest that I could find was BIOS update. Is that what you meant?

I am new to hardware so I do not fully understand these things or how to find them.

Thank You.

Captain Kirk
 
I've had a look on Dell's website and there isn't a chipset driver available sorry, or at least not for Windows 2000.

I think you need to give up on this now. It's an old machine. Probably had a hard life...
 
Captain Kirk said:
Okedokey,

So you've narrowed the problem down to either the CPU, the mobo, or the RAM?

I suspect its the mobo as the culprit.
But just so I know in the future, what would be the symtoms of a failing CPU?

And, for future reference, I was wondering if you could help me figure out what you meant by the "driver chipset update", because I went to intel and found the correct model and make of my computer but I did no see ANY listings of what you call "driver chipset update"!
The closest that I could find was BIOS update. Is that what you meant?

I am new to hardware so I do not fully understand these things or how to find them.

Thank You.

Captain Kirk
Click to expand...

Chipset drivers here

http://www.intel.com/design/software/drivers/platform/archived_inf.htm

CPU failures can cause any type of bsod.

Following from that and assuming your PSU is sufficient, then reinstall the OS. That way you're sure its hardware.

Then if that doesn't solve it, replace with known good, each component until you narrow it down. That's the only way.
 
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Not really worth spending a lot of money replacing parts on a laptop this old, as I have said before.
 
Spirit,
Hi

I just now realized that RAM couldn't cause the computer to boot by itself.
So, if effect, there would be no sense in completing 3 separate RAM tests (or 4 if this computer wasn't in such bad shape).
As, all that the RAM tests would be doing would only be testing whether the RAM itself was bad (or still good) and would have nothing to do with checking for errors with the computer itself -- given the results of this last test.:rolleyes:

I also just now realized that there is no other hardware components in the computer that could cause the computer to boot by itself -- therefore concluding the results of a failing board.:eek:

Certainty of results: 95% :gun:

As far as fixing the computer: well, at this point, it looks like the only fixing that will do any good would be to replace an ENTIRE board -- in which case may be hard to find, and really not worth it: the computer is of such a low MHz that it wouldn't be worth the trouble.
However, if this was the computer "case" frame of a 2 Gig or so computer, then such an endeavor might be a fun thing to try and conquer.
But my first "building my own computer" is going to be with a desktop, not a laptop, because I know much more about it.
And for "building my own computer" for a laptop (which is exactly what this would be considering its failing hardware), I don't think it would be worth it in terms of cost -- it would only be worth it for the experience and enjoyment of accomplishing it.;)

Hey bro -- do you think that so I know in the future, and so that I understand a little bit more about hardware and how to find things related to hardware --
[[about what was mentioned reguarding the "chipset driver update"]], that you could tell me what this is referring to (the BIOS?), or was it not in the list at the dell site?
I also looked on the dell site for the model of a second computer, and in both instances, there was not a listing for "chipset driver update".
How would I find this?
Is it located on the dell site (for a dell computer)?
Was I looking under the right name ("chipset driver update": it was not in the list)?:confused:

I do not understand hardware very well -- it is a bit confusing, and Okeydoky lost me on this one. It is over my head. Obviously I am not a hardware expert yet.:(

Captain Kirk
 
Definitely not worth replacing the motherboard. I think it's time to wave goodbye to this laptop now. :(
 
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