Intel Pentium IV & AMD 64

[Rambo]

Hello all!

I recently got into computers about 4 months ago, and successfully managed to build my first computer in December

I know alot about AMD Athlon XP, which is what I currently am using, but I want to learn about different kinds. I have heard about Intel Pentium 4 and AMD's 64 bit processing, which has made me curious...

I think I want to build another computer, and this time, using an AMD 64 or Intel Pentium 4.

The only problem is I don't know much about Intel (sockets, etc..) and the other kinds of sockets for AMD CPU's (such as 939 and 754??).

Basically, what I'm asking is for some knowledge about what makes these processors better than the XP's, and why.
Also, what I don't understand is when I view a webpage about AMD 64 CPU's nothing talks about the clock speed (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Socket_754.html). How do i find out what this clock speed is. I see that AMD 64 uses similar numbers like 3000+ or 2800+ or 3200+, as like the Athlon XP does. Is there anyway to find out the clock speed from the numbers?

I have a couple of questions too:

If I was to make make a gaming PC, which would you choose:

Intel Pentium 4

or

AMD 64

I'm kind of swaying towards building computers on the AMD side of technology, simply because I use an AMD Athlon XP right now.

Well, thanks all, and i hope you can help me out with some much needed information.

 

[double-dragon]

Gaming PC - AMD
Video editing etc - P4

Thats about the extent of my knowledge at 2:35am

 

[Kboy]

All the reports that I've read have put AMD ahead of Intel for gaming. I am going to build a new PC pretty soon, and I plan on using AMD largely because you get more power for your dollar.
I really don't know much else about all those new processors, but if you are interested, pick up an issue of MaximumPC. They have a lot of reviews of new processors and stuff like that. I've learned a lot through my subscription.

 

[Cromewell]

www.anandtech.com does a good job reviewing hardware.

and as stated before take a A64 for a gaming computer, and a 939 would be better than a 754

 

[sypher822]

THESE ARE ALL THE 64BIT AMD PROCESSORS AVAILABLE:
with breif specs

2800+ 1.8GHz - Socket 754 - 1600MHz FSB
3000+ 1.8GHz - Socket 939 - 2000MHz FSB
3000+ 2.0GHz - Socket 754 - 1600MHz FSB
3200+ 2.0GHz - Socket 754 - 1600MHz FSB
3200+ 2.0GHz - Socket 939 - 2000MHz FSB
3400+ 2.2GHz - Socket 754 - 1600MHz FSB
3500+ 2.2GHz - Socket 939 - 2000MHz FSB
3700+ 2.4GHz - Socket 754 - 1600MHz FSB
3800+ 2.4GHz - Socket 939 - 1600MHz FSB
4000+ 2.4GHz - Socket 939 - 2000MHz FSB
FX-51 2.2GHz - Socket 940 - 1600MHz FSB
FX-53 2.4GHz - Socket 939 - 2000MHz FSB
FX-53 2.4GHz - Socket 940 - 1600MHz FSB
FX-55 2.6GHz - Socket 939 - 2000MHz FSB

 

[Praetor]

THESE ARE ALL THE 64BIT AMD PROCESSORS AVAILABLE

Whoa that list is far from complete.

Athlon64-2800 Series
ADA2800AEP4AK
ADA2800AEP4AX

Athlon64-3000 Series (I have no idea what the 'K' desginates, im guessing 80ºC)
ADA3000AEP4AP
ADA3000AEP4AX
AMA3000BEX5AP
ADA3000DIK4BI

Athlon64-3200 Series
ADA3200AEP4AX
AMA3200BEX5AR
ADA3200DIK4BI

Athlon64-3400 Series
ADA3400AEP4AX
AMA3400BEX5AP
There is a ADA3400DEX4* chip too but ive not been able to track down the codes (i.e., Sypher has such a chip)


Athlon64-3500 Series
ADA3500DEP4AW
ADA3500DIK4BI

Athlon64-3700 Series
ADA3700AEP5AR
AMA3700BEX5AR

Athlon64-3800 Series
ADA3800DEP4AW

Athlon64-4000 Series
ADA4000DEP5AS

Athlon64-FX Chips (i have no idea what the 'I' desginates, possibly 85ºC)
ADAFX51CEI5?? (I dont know the rev's for the FX51)
ADAFX53CEI5AS
ADAFX53DEI5AS
ADAFX55DEI5AS


Yeah .. and my list is far from complete. A second note, the Athlon64 processors dont have a front-side-bus, they have a hypertransport tunnel. If you are interesting in decoding what the above model numbers mean, have a look at this http://www.hardwarezone.com/guides/amd-socket939/index.php?pg=2

 

[Rambo]

Thank you

Right then.

I've done some research and 939 is better than 754, yes? Because socket 939 has more pins, it can do 'dual-mode' with RAM or something like that...?

How much better would a socket 939 be from a 754? Would there be a big performance boost?

Thanks for the information of all those processors Sypher and Praetor (big list!! )

3200+ 2.0GHz - Socket 939 - 2000MHz FSB

Praetor said that:

A second note, the Athlon64 processors dont have a front-side-bus, they have a hypertransport tunnel

But Sypher has in his list - 'FSB'. You say there is no FSB on Athlon 64's.

Thanks,

Rambo.

 

[Bobo]

I've done some research and 939 is better than 754, yes? Because socket 939 has more pins, it can do 'dual-mode' with RAM or something like that...?

Yes, 939 is better than 754, and it can do dual-channel RAM

But Sypher has in his list - 'FSB'. You say there is no FSB on Athlon 64's.

Without going too in depth, FSB=HTT

 

[robina_80]

go for AMD there cheap on the whole and there just or more faster than intel

 

[Bobo]

go for AMD there cheap on the whole

Not necessarily at all, look at the FX series, the a64 3700, 3800, and 4000

Granted, those are a lot better than p4s, but also more expensive

 

[robina_80]

no no i disagree, the same intel chips are not more expensive but expensive than the same AMD chips plus amd run faster they give more heat but who cares

 

[Bobo]

no no i disagree, the same intel chips are not more expensive but expensive than the same AMD chips plus amd run faster they give more heat but who cares

I think a lot of people care...

The socket 775 is pretty much fine, it is the socket 478, especially the prescotts that have heat problems

 

[Rambo]

What's so special about these FX series CPU's? I don't think I'll buy one, but I would like to know why they're so good

Thanks for all the info!

Also, for anyone who's good with motherbaords, what would be a good gaming ASUS or ABIT motherboard with perhaps an AMD 64 3000+ Socket 939?

Cheers

 

[Blue]

You wont go wrong with either a 754 or a 939 set up but If I was to recommend a setup I'd say 939 all the way but also dont forget to keep an eye on that L2 Cache that alot of people ignore... L2 cache is basicly the reason why I purchase my particuler proc (754 SK) because at the time the L2 cache was very attractive (1mb) which is important for gaming and also it was compared to the Athlon FX 51 as being nearly equal to performance which was a top selling cpu at the time I made my purchase ...

Anhow all i'm saying is dont forget L2 cache ;-). For me it was more important then dual channel memory.

 

[sypher822]

THESE ARE ALL THE 64BIT AMD PROCESSORS AVAILABLE:

sorry i should have phrased that differently...

i was only including the straight models, like 3000+, or 2800+, and the difference between socket 754, and 939, at least when it comes to processing speed and FSB.

altho, i was not aware that amd had so many more models than that, i knew of a few

 

[sypher822]

i would get an ASUS motherboard. I run an ASUS mobo for all of my computers and i have never had a problem

ASUS mobos, are reliable, and relatively fairly priced.

 

[Echo_]

Not necessarily at all, look at the FX series, the a64 3700, 3800, and 4000

Granted, those are a lot better than p4s, but also more expensive

i think hes saying that an amd that is equal to a intel is a lot cheaper

 

[Praetor]

Because socket 939 has more pins, it can do 'dual-mode' with RAM or something like that...?

Number of pins is just coincidence.

How much better would a socket 939 be from a 754? Would there be a big performance boost?

Depends whether you OC or not. If you OC then can be a case where there is not much of a difference for comparable procs.

But Sypher has in his list - 'FSB'. You say there is no FSB on Athlon 64's

Sypher is wrong.

Without going too in depth, FSB=HTT

Aye, think of a HTT/HTL as a full-duplex FSB

go for AMD there cheap on the whole and there just or more faster than intel

1. LOL "more faster"
2. Comparable Prescotts are cheaper

Not necessarily at all, look at the FX series, the a64 3700, 3800, and 4000

Look at the EE and 570, 560 and BTX chips

no no I disagree, the same intel chips are not more expensive but expensive than the same AMD chips plus amd run faster they give more heat but who cares

1. There is no such thing as "same Intel chips"
2. Intel chips produce waaaaaaaaaay less heat per clock and overall, less heat
3. People decidng between processors care

it is the socket 478, especially the prescotts that have heat problems

Just the prescotts, the Northwoods were good

What's so special about these FX series CPU's? I don't think I'll buy one, but I would like to know why they're so good

Fully unlocked multipliers

Also, for anyone who's good with motherbaords, what would be a good gaming ASUS or ABIT motherboard with perhaps an AMD 64 3000+ Socket 939?

Abit doesnt make good AMD boards. They choose the go all out on the Intel boards. Their loss. Other than the A8N SLI board, ASUS makes crap for AMD chips as well.

but also dont forget to keep an eye on that L2 Cache that alot of people ignore... L2 cache is basicly the reason why I purchase my particuler proc (754 SK) because at the time the L2 cache was very attractive (1mb) which is important for gaming and also it was compared to the Athlon FX 51 as being nearly equal to performance which was a top selling cpu at the time I made my purchase ...

Whoa. L2 doesnt make that much difference for AMD chips man (i.e., notice how similarly clocked Newcastle chips were not totally run-over by the 'Hammers). Also, being compared to the FX51 is nothing 'special' per se given (1) A socket754 + nF3-250 will damn near challenge a socket939 + nf3U (and easily contest most socket939 + k8t800Pro) setups and (2) the FX51 ran a much slower HTT and used registered memory and was stuck with the crummy k8t800

Anhow all i'm saying is dont forget L2 cache ;-). For me it was more important then dual channel memory.

If you're considering within socket754 chips perhaps but for AMD procs as a whole, its not as earth shattering (especially considering the massive L1 they pack)

sorry I should have phrased that differently...
i was only including the straight models, like 3000+, or 2800+, and the difference between socket 754, and 939, at least when it comes to processing speed and FSB.

Ah no worries, the only reason its useful to note the codes is that with the AMD packaging, you can look at the actual chip and see the code on the chip before you buy it

ASUS mobos, are reliable, and relatively fairly priced.

I dunno about fairly priced

i think hes saying that an amd that is equal to a intel is a lot cheaper

Perhaps but Prescotts are often cheaper than their comparable Socket939 brethen

 

[Rambo]

Hello!

Thanks everyone for your useful information!!

Some more questions (sorry!):

@ Praetor

Other than the A8N SLI board, ASUS makes crap for AMD chips as well.

I saw that motherboard, thought it was pretty good too. just that I think that is a bit pricey for me.... What do you think to:

Abit AX8 (Socket 939) PCI-Express Motherboard ( i know you said they aren't good for AMD, but, what do you think anyway? )

Specs:

ABIT AX8 powered by VIA K8T890/VT8237 chipsets based on AMD Athlon 64/64FX Socket 939 CPU. The AX8 features SATA RAIDm Dual DDR400, PCI Express, IEEE1394 and Gigabit LAN including ABIT engineered µGuru for optimum overall system. This board is the performer if the year. Using the groundbreaking Hyper Transport Technology and gushing with extra capacity and peripherals support as well as first class onboard 5.1-channel audio, this board can be easily be your foundation for a superb system.

- µGuru
- Thermal Guard™
- SoftMenu™ Technology
- PCI Express Support
- Hyper Transport Technology
- Dual DDR 400
- Serial ATA 150 RAID
- IEEE 1394
- Gigabit LAN
- USB 2.0 Supports 480 Mb/s data transfer rate
- 6-Channel Audio
- S/PDIF In/Out
- Supports only PCI-E VGA Cards (AGP not supported)
- ATX v2.0 compliant PSU Required for PCI-E Graphics/Motherboard

and...

FoxConn NF4UK8AA-8EKRS nForce4 Ultra (Socket 939) Motherboard (MB-001-FC)
The NVIDIA nForce™4 MCP (media and communications processor) enhances your AMD Athlon 64 and Sempron-based system with powerful features like ”instant on” secure networking, an advanced storage solution that protects your valuable digital media assets, and PCI Express™, the industry’s latest bus architecture for graphics and expansion cards. With the NVIDIA nForce4 MCPs, you get an unbelievable advantage in maintaining and managing your complete desktop PC. NVIDIA nForce4 MCPs include the ICSA-certified NVIDIA Firewall solution that protects your PC from unscrupulous hackers and malicious spyware while connected through a fast Gigabit Ethernet interface to the Internet or a LAN. Play online games, stream videos, download files, or share data throughout your home or home-office network with the knowledge that your connection is protected. NVIDIA storage solutions allow you to confidently protect and save your most important digital assets from hard drive failure or corruption. A simple-to-use interface makes disk management a breeze and gives you peace of mind that your treasured digital assets are reliably available and protected for the future. You can easily add additional hard disk drives and be alerted should any drive fail. Lastly, the unique single-chip, low-latency architecture of the NVIDIA nForce4 MCPs offers one of the industry’s best core-logic solutions with outstanding performance and market leading features.

- Supports Socket 939 for AMD Athlon™ 64 and 64 FX processors
- Up to 2000 MT/s HyperTransport™
- Max 4GB Dual channel DDR400 / DDR333 / DDR 266 DRAM
- 2 PCIe x 1
- 4 Serial ATA II w/ RAID 0, 1, 0+1
- 7.1 channel, AC97 interface
- CIS8201 (GbE LAN)
- IEEE 1394 (Fire Wire) Support
- Supports up to 8 USB 2.0 ports
- ATX v2.0 compliant PSU Required for PCI-E Graphics/Motherboard

What about those two then? Any good, or totally rubbish?

Also, which is new to me....I see on these new motherboards, slots, which look like mini-pci slots They look small and stuff (man I'm great at describing!). What are they?

Cheers

 

[Blue]

I would also mention that duel channel does not make an earth shattering difference although some seem to think so. I guess "Duel Channel" just sounds fast to some .