PS4, finally to be unveiled?

[G80FTW]

I don't believe anybody has ever been more wrong on these forums.

First off, PC gaming is still a hell of a lot more popular than consoles. Right now the number 1 game in the world, League of Legends, is a PC exclusive game. They have more users than there are active XBL subscribers, they have more E-Sports tournament money than any other game in history with more spectators than any other game in history.

You take into account all PC exclusive games, like all of your MMO's, the main Sims games, the rest of the MOBA games besides the previously mentioned LoL, not only does the PC beat the Xbox, it beats all of the three major consoles so far as sales and user figures are concerned combined.

And then consider the Facebook and browser games. Than in itself adds another 7, if not 8, figure number onto the number of users. I personally don't fully count these though, as your think of PC gaming, you think of a desktop or laptop, and a lot of these users are not on tablets, however the majority are still on their PC.

Secondly, companies are not developing for PC any more? Come on... The biggest games of the last decade originated on PC and are still developed for PC, like CoD, which was PC only or MoH, which was PC only. Then look at more recent games that have been major talking points, Minecraft, LoL, Dayz, all of them are either still PC exclusive or developed mainly for PC. To say no team is developing for PC, yet failing to look at the likes of Mojang, Riot, Bohemia, Blizzard, Valve and Creative Assembly and the countless indie developers is extremely ignorant and short sighted. Even your developers selling games on more than one platform, like Activision and EA still develop and sell their games on PC.

Thirdly, you are ignoring mods completely. Most developers make an extremely good platform and they bug fix but stop. That means on a console you get what you are given. With PC though, the mod community will keep people coming. You mention Crysis 3 being the best looking game on PC, but I would argue that Crysis 1 with mods, GTA4 with mods or even the upcoming Arma 3 as standard look far better.

People said at the release of the PS3 and 360 that PC gaming was now over. Just look how wrong they are. You think that if a developer stopped making games for PC completely that there aren't 100 that will come and fill their spot with equally as good or better games? PC gaming is going nowhere, now or in the foreseeable future

I dont want, nor do I care about pay by the month MMOs. The PC market is too saturated with that time consuming useless junk. Thats not a true gaming experience if you ask me. And those kind of developers dont focus on what current hardware can do, but instead try to make the game as graphically challenged as possible so every PC can play it smooth.

If by CoD and MoH you mean Call of Duty and Medal of Honor, what are you talking about PC only? Both have been console focused games since the start..... I have the latest Medal of Honor, looks the same on PC as it does on console aside from the obvious AA that PC offers.

Valve may be the last hope, but even they started getting into the console market themselves. Hopefully we dont lose them too.

You didnt get my point. Yes games are still made for PC as well as console. And Im sure they will for decades to come. My point is, we have no more hardcore developers left to push the PC hardware. If everyone is focusing on what 7 year old hardware can do, we will never know what my i7 and 680 can do. In fact, I still have no idea what my graphics card I paid so much money for can do. As far as I can see, it puts out the same graphics as my 7 year old Xbox. Because 98% of games are developed for it not my PC. Metro 2033 was the only multi-platform game I have seen that did it right so far.

I never said Crysis 3 has the best graphics, I said it was SUPPOSED to. But it doesnt. We all know CryEngine 3 is probably one of the most advanced graphics engines available, but Crytek refuse to release a game using its power. Instead they just tease us with it. The only way to see what Cry3 can do is to play around in the dev kit. Pointless crap.

Crysis 3 "wont" rape PS4 in quality. Its been out here since 19th, and I can tell you first hand it comes no where near the PS4 in quality. It doesnt even compare to other games in quality.

 

[Aastii]

For MMO's, that is your preference, but the MMO games are still PC games whether you like to play them or not.

Call of Duty was PC only, it was 5 years after that they released it on Xbox, the same year that MW2 came out. It has only been on consoles since CoD2.

Medal of Honor, was console first and there have been several console exclusives, however the PC exclusives, AA, Spearhead, Breakthrough and PA were all much better and more successful, so much so that even now there are still AA leagues and tournaments, whereas MoH and all of the console titles have died completely.

For hardcore PC developers, please re-read the entire post, there is even a nice, tidy list in there. Tell me how Mojang, Riot, Bohemia, Blizzard, Valve and Creative Assembly, even Dice who are a massive one that I missed out, aren't PC focused. Dice go and make BF3, a AAA title and they develop it for PC first and foremost, then port it to consoles with stuff taken out. When a company goes and does that with a title expected to challenge the likes of CoD and it is published by a company like EA, are you still going to try and claim that no developers care about PC?

That is only a short list too. If you want games that will push your hardware from these developers and from modders, you aren't looking very far. Go and play ArmA 2, or play GTA4 with the photorealism mod or Crysis 1 with DX11 and texture mods. Not only do they blow the "next gen" consoles away, they will give your hardware a bit of a challenge if you are playing at anything over 1920x1080.

The whole post is pointless though really, you are still sure that there is (was)only Crytek that made games for PC only, but don't know about most of the PC game developers. I will dig this thread back up at the release of the PS5 if you are still about and show you, from my gaming system, just how "dead" PC gaming is

 

[G80FTW]

For MMO's, that is your preference, but the MMO games are still PC games whether you like to play them or not.

Call of Duty was PC only, it was 5 years after that they released it on Xbox, the same year that MW2 came out. It has only been on consoles since CoD2.

Medal of Honor, was console first and there have been several console exclusives, however the PC exclusives, AA, Spearhead, Breakthrough and PA were all much better and more successful, so much so that even now there are still AA leagues and tournaments, whereas MoH and all of the console titles have died completely.

For hardcore PC developers, please re-read the entire post, there is even a nice, tidy list in there. Tell me how Mojang, Riot, Bohemia, Blizzard, Valve and Creative Assembly, even Dice who are a massive one that I missed out, aren't PC focused. Dice go and make BF3, a AAA title and they develop it for PC first and foremost, then port it to consoles with stuff taken out. When a company goes and does that with a title expected to challenge the likes of CoD and it is published by a company like EA, are you still going to try and claim that no developers care about PC?

That is only a short list too. If you want games that will push your hardware from these developers and from modders, you aren't looking very far. Go and play ArmA 2, or play GTA4 with the photorealism mod or Crysis 1 with DX11 and texture mods. Not only do they blow the "next gen" consoles away, they will give your hardware a bit of a challenge if you are playing at anything over 1920x1080.

The whole post is pointless though really, you are still sure that there is (was)only Crytek that made games for PC only, but don't know about most of the PC game developers. I will dig this thread back up at the release of the PS5 if you are still about and show you, from my gaming system, just how "dead" PC gaming is

BF3 was not designed for PC, it was designed for console. It just so happens that there isnt a difference between PC and console in terms of graphics? Come on. Medal of Honor Warfighter, which uses the same engine, looks exactly the same as BF3 but was said to look better. Dice and EA are feeding you crap as usual. BF1942 was the only good game Dice ever made.

ArmA 2 is the only game you listed that will bring my PC down to even 30fps and that is because of its depth. Its not exactly screaming with DX11 toys since its a DX9 game. So no. Crysis 1, doesnt phase my PC. GTA4, even with mods the people still look horrid and the lighting system leaves alot to be desired (I have GTA4 fully modded) not only that, it doesnt "push" my hardware as much as not use it. GTA4, as everyone hopefully knows by now, was horribly optimized for PC. Thus, it cannot make good use of hardware. My 30-40fps in GTA4 is not because its pushing my PC, its the exact opposite. It doesnt know what to do with the hardware.

So MMOs aside, developers do not care about PC gamers. Pretty much what
Im saying it, any game that is on console was MADE for console and its PC counter-part will not look any different. Metro 2033 still being the only exception. Of course, it was REALLY designed for PC. Something Dice can claim they did all they want but it was a load of crap like everything else them and EA say. Probably 2 of the most power money hungry companies out there.

You still dont get it though. Just because I can play BF3 or MoH on my PC doesnt mean that the games were developed for PC. Why would I want to spend $1,500 on a gaming PC just to play the same games my $400 (now $100) Xbox can? Kinda defeats the purpose of building a gaming PC does it not?

Oh, and I would suggest actually watching the press conference of the PS4 before saying any of those games blow it away. Because they come no where close. Nothing on PC looks anything like what I saw. And it only makes sense. Because as we all know, console hardware has the advantage to developers of being static meaning the games can be designed specially for that hardware and now that the hardware is from this century we can see what our PCs COULD have done had developers taken the time to do it.

 

[Aastii]

You are very funny

BF3 was developed for PC primarily and cut back for consoles. The game itself was relased on PC first, before it came out on consoles, all DLC was on PC first before consoles, all of the trailers and announcements were shown on PC (bar a couple if I remember correctly at live events where it wasn't really practical to drag out a full PC), it was a PC game primarily.

Arma doesn't necessarily need the bells and whistles of DX11, however for it to be played as it was intended, as a simulator, the view distance should be the same as what a person would be able to see, so all the way up. Anything less is a hardware limitation, the same as it would be with any other game.

Crysis 1, I didn't say as a standard game, my 560Ti can handle it no problem, I am saying with the DX11 and texture mods on.

GTA 4 when modded, especially with the photorealism mod, is a strain on any system, and not because of optimisation, my system can max it out on default no problem, but with mods, different story. It is because the mod makes the game so demanding. You are smoking something if you think it doesn't look good either.

For the comments about games on consoles are all designed primarily for consoles, that is cute. Half-Life 2, Counter Strike, Portal, BF3, The Sims, Diablo 3, all of them designed for console primarily?

As for your "point", there isn't one, you don't need to drop 1500 on a gaming system, maybe use some common sense the next time you build a computer. If you don't plan on using multiple monitors, if you don't plan on using high resolutions, if you don't plan on using extremely demanding mods, don't get top of the line hardware. You just seem butt hurt that you dropped this money on a computer and realise what a waste it was when for half the price you could do exactly the same stuff.

PC gaming is cheaper than console gaming, that much is a fact. The way PC gaming works for the consumer is the same way console gaming works for the manufacturer. For every PS3 Sony sold at first they lost money, but made that money back from game sales and later unit sales. With a PC, you can, instead of the ~£300 price tag of a new console, pay ~£500 and have a gaming PC that can max out all games and will last on at least high settings for a good 2-3 years. You then make all of that money back on games.

Your £300 console is useless if you do not have games, the same as a gaming PC is. Over here a new console game is around £45-60. For the sake of simplicity, let's say £50. A PC game however is around £30-40, so let's say £35. That is £15 saved on every game. After you have got 10 games, you have a £50 deficit. Let's say over those 2 years that your system is still playing on high settings at least, you buy 20 games. You are £150 up on the PC. A graphics card upgrade and you are back to max settings, so with the sale of your old graphics card, you are now breaking even. Everything after that is a bonus.

In reality, it is even better than this. I have my PS3 sat next to me and all 13 games that I own for it. Those 13 games cost me around the same as my 182 games that I have on Steam. If I bought 182 PS3 games that would have cost me a hell of a lot. You also will not have the added luxury, at least not with the 720, of buying pre-owned games

 

[tech savvy]

With regards to GDDR5 memory, there is a reason we do not have it, in fact several fairly obvious reasons.

Firstly, as has been said, so far as performance is concerned it is not necessary. The way the PS4 works and the way a PC works are similar but different, the same as all consoles are. Whenever you play a game on PC, 9 times out of 10 it is the CPU or graphics card holding you back, not your memory. Outside of games, it is your CPU or hard drive, or the density of the memory, again, not the speed of your memory. You could throw in an extra theoretical 4GB/s or so speed to your RAM, but it won't actually show any difference at all.

The, "far as performance is concerned it is not necessary" that's not a good enough of an excuse not to have it. Performance is never enough.

Then point number three which is tied into that, no consumer in their right mind would drop money on new memory, a new motherboard and likely a new CPU as a new memory controller would be needed when they cannot upgrade from it and when what they have will be very far behind within the space of a few months. This isn't like a new graphics card coming out every 12 months or so, because you can't get rid of your old and get a new. With this you would have to get yet another new motherboard, new CPU and new memory. For 99% of users this is not practical so they will not buy it, making all of the aforementioned money spent on developing a system to utilise the memory by hardware manufacturers wasted

We will have to do that anyway, when DDR4/5 come. So that's pointless.

I don't believe anybody has ever been more wrong on these forums.

First off, PC gaming is still a hell of a lot more popular than consoles. Right now the number 1 game in the world, League of Legends, is a PC exclusive game. They have more users than there are active XBL subscribers, they have more E-Sports tournament money than any other game in history with more spectators than any other game in history.

I never played that game in my life, and know anyone that does.

You take into account all PC exclusive games, like all of your MMO's, the main Sims games, the rest of the MOBA games besides the previously mentioned LoL, not only does the PC beat the Xbox, it beats all of the three major consoles so far as sales and user figures are concerned combined.

Put MMO's aside, if I recall, the top selling PC game of all time is Sims 2(20 million). All three console companies, Play Station, Xbox, Nintendo all have games that sold more then 20 million copies. If you add up all the sells from Atari 2600 till now, there is noway PC games top that, that's with all the MMO's and what-not.

And then consider the Facebook and browser games. Than in itself adds another 7, if not 8, figure number onto the number of users. I personally don't fully count these though, as your think of PC gaming, you think of a desktop or laptop, and a lot of these users are not on tablets, however the majority are still on their PC.

The majority of browser games are played on cell phone/tables, slowly leaving the PC. And I don't consider them official PC games.

Secondly, companies are not developing for PC any more? Come on... The biggest games of the last decade originated on PC and are still developed for PC, like CoD, which was PC only or MoH, which was PC only. Then look at more recent games that have been major talking points, Minecraft, LoL, Dayz, all of them are either still PC exclusive or developed mainly for PC. To say no team is developing for PC, yet failing to look at the likes of Mojang, Riot, Bohemia, Blizzard, Valve and Creative Assembly and the countless indie developers is extremely ignorant and short sighted. Even your developers selling games on more than one platform, like Activision and EA still develop and sell their games on PC.

PC exclusive games are all slowly converting over to consoles. Why? Because they realize people can't afford to drop $1000+ on a PC to play PC games at there full potential. Instead, spend $400-$500 on a PS4 and get the same graphics performance as a $1000+ gaming rig.

Thirdly, you are ignoring mods completely. Most developers make an extremely good platform and they bug fix but stop. That means on a console you get what you are given. With PC though, the mod community will keep people coming. You mention Crysis 3 being the best looking game on PC, but I would argue that Crysis 1 with mods, GTA4 with mods or even the upcoming Arma 3 as standard look far better.

Wouldn't know, never played Crysis 3, or any Crysis for that matter.

People said at the release of the PS3 and 360 that PC gaming was now over. Just look how wrong they are. You think that if a developer stopped making games for PC completely that there aren't 100 that will come and fill their spot with equally as good or better games? PC gaming is going nowhere, now or in the foreseeable future

I never said that PS3/360 was going to replace PC gaming.


But all else aside, we all know that our first game ever played was on a console.

Fun facts:

The cathode ray tube amusement device is the earliest known interactive electronic game. Which by the way is considered a 'gaming device', not a computer.

Computers, at the beginning, was never meant for gaming, they just evolved over time.

Definition of a Computer-An electronic device for storing and processing data, typically in binary form, according to instructions given to it in a variable program.

Definition of a console-A video game console is an interactive entertainment computer or customized computer system that produces a video display signal which can be used with a display device to display a video game. The term "video game console" is used to distinguish a machine designed for people to buy and use primarily for playing video games on a TV.

 

[G80FTW]

You are very funny

BF3 was developed for PC primarily and cut back for consoles. The game itself was relased on PC first, before it came out on consoles, all DLC was on PC first before consoles, all of the trailers and announcements were shown on PC (bar a couple if I remember correctly at live events where it wasn't really practical to drag out a full PC), it was a PC game primarily.

Arma doesn't necessarily need the bells and whistles of DX11, however for it to be played as it was intended, as a simulator, the view distance should be the same as what a person would be able to see, so all the way up. Anything less is a hardware limitation, the same as it would be with any other game.

Crysis 1, I didn't say as a standard game, my 560Ti can handle it no problem, I am saying with the DX11 and texture mods on.

GTA 4 when modded, especially with the photorealism mod, is a strain on any system, and not because of optimisation, my system can max it out on default no problem, but with mods, different story. It is because the mod makes the game so demanding. You are smoking something if you think it doesn't look good either.

For the comments about games on consoles are all designed primarily for consoles, that is cute. Half-Life 2, Counter Strike, Portal, BF3, The Sims, Diablo 3, all of them designed for console primarily?

As for your "point", there isn't one, you don't need to drop 1500 on a gaming system, maybe use some common sense the next time you build a computer. If you don't plan on using multiple monitors, if you don't plan on using high resolutions, if you don't plan on using extremely demanding mods, don't get top of the line hardware. You just seem butt hurt that you dropped this money on a computer and realise what a waste it was when for half the price you could do exactly the same stuff.

PC gaming is cheaper than console gaming, that much is a fact. The way PC gaming works for the consumer is the same way console gaming works for the manufacturer. For every PS3 Sony sold at first they lost money, but made that money back from game sales and later unit sales. With a PC, you can, instead of the ~£300 price tag of a new console, pay ~£500 and have a gaming PC that can max out all games and will last on at least high settings for a good 2-3 years. You then make all of that money back on games.

Your £300 console is useless if you do not have games, the same as a gaming PC is. Over here a new console game is around £45-60. For the sake of simplicity, let's say £50. A PC game however is around £30-40, so let's say £35. That is £15 saved on every game. After you have got 10 games, you have a £50 deficit. Let's say over those 2 years that your system is still playing on high settings at least, you buy 20 games. You are £150 up on the PC. A graphics card upgrade and you are back to max settings, so with the sale of your old graphics card, you are now breaking even. Everything after that is a bonus.

In reality, it is even better than this. I have my PS3 sat next to me and all 13 games that I own for it. Those 13 games cost me around the same as my 182 games that I have on Steam. If I bought 182 PS3 games that would have cost me a hell of a lot. You also will not have the added luxury, at least not with the 720, of buying pre-owned games

Im pretty sure your the one smoking. Like I said, I have GTA4 modded out, and yes it looks good, but its nothing more than blur effects with increased texture resolutions. Thats it. The lighting system is still the same, with some tweaks, the shading is the same, the "high" resolution textures are not much different from the standard which begs the question why waste 4GB downloading them, and at the end of the day its still a DX9 game from 2008 that lacks any modern graphical features. With or without mods.

Games are cheaper on PC? Since when? I just paid $65 after taxes for Crysis 3 on PC. Guess how much it would have cost to get it on Xbox? Exactly the same. PC games cost the same as console games when they are new. Maybe in your part of the world things are different, but I highly doubt PC games come out cheaper there than anywhere else.

Try building a $500 PC that will play BF3 or Crysis 3 maxed or even your GTA4 with mods. Wont happen. Especially with GTA4. Optimization is the reason consoles still exist. Because it is their sole purpose and design to do so.

It cost me $1,500 to build a PC from the ground up to play Crysis 3 and BF3 at acceptable frame rates with nearly the same quality as my Xbox (AA and AF aside). So dont even give me the "PC gaming is cheaper" round about because its clearly not. Especially if you factor in your blessed pay by the month MMOs. Then PC gaming becomes as expensive as owning my CL600.

You believe BF3 was designed for PC because EA and Dice told you so and because you believe it was released on PC first (which it wasnt). Where are you getting your information? EA is hardly a reliable source, as all they have been doing for the past decade is trying to milk all the money they can from customers like you with all their DLC that cost 4x as much as the game.

As for the valve games, if anyone bought those for console it would surprise me. Because until they finally did release Counter-Strike for console it was played out and old. Im sure it probably sold about 100 copies or so though. Very successful console title I can imagine.

Make all that money back on games? What are you talking about? You PAY money for games they dont pay you to buy them.....

 

[G80FTW]

GTA 4 when modded, especially with the photorealism mod, is a strain on any system, and not because of optimisation It is because the mod makes the game so demanding.

This is completely false and makes me question your intellect on game design.






I want to be sure to make my point very clear, as to not confuse anyone with this being a PC versus console battle because thats not what this is. This is about PC gaming becoming obsolete, and by that, I mean games that are designed for the PC only. Not MMOs.

Im talking about games like Doom, Duke Nukem, Flight Simulator (which im not sure if they are still producing games, last one I know of is X which came out what like 4 years or so ago?), Mech Warrior (possibly the BEST PC game ever created. Went over to console in 2001-2002 and havent seen it since.), and BF 1942. These are the games that people like me grew up playing and these are the games that got people like me into PC gaming in the first place. Not because of their epic stories (lets face it, all these games either have no stories or very dull ones that no one paid attention to), but because of their gameplay and graphics. The 2 most important things a game must have. Leave the stories for the cinema. If I recall, both Doom and Mech Warrior were some of the most graphically advanced games of their respective times. The last time we saw a developer strive to do that, was in 2007 with Crysis. Nothing since has been developed to push the envelope of computer hardware.

 

[Okedokey]

Crysis 3 is pushing hardware, Far Cry 3 is pushing hardware, BF3 still pushes hardware, Skyrim pushes hardware. I believe all of these were designed with PC in mind.

 

[Hyper-Threaded]

In a few years, newer, stronger hardware will come out, just as the ps3 and xbox 360, and equal hardware will be cheaper. History repeats itself alot.

 

[G80FTW]

Crysis 3 is pushing hardware, Far Cry 3 is pushing hardware, BF3 still pushes hardware, Skyrim pushes hardware. I believe all of these were designed with PC in mind.

They dont push my PC. I get 50-60fps in BF3 maxed and thats only because I have vsync on that it wont go past 60. Far Cry 3 I havent played on PC, but from what I seen it had nothing in mind but ugly. Skyrim, same deal, 50fps no problem.

 

[CrazyMike]

Man, this thread blew right up! lol All this discussion about PC vs Console (or some have put it, PC gaming is dieing out).

I believe PC gaming will never die out because as hardware for the PC evolves it pushes for dev to push the envelope of Games. PC hardware is advancing (very popular i might add) at an alarming rate. Take a look at the rate of which video cards are coming out! (Here's just an example) They are always pushing technology. In otherwords, PC's are the drive for innovation. I believe that this drive for innovation is because of "Us" PC gamers/enthusiasts.

Now it's true that the term "PC" can be brought in many different directions. For instance, people believe that Consoles will be the new "PC" (using the term PC as the thought of desktop computers). I believe this to a certain point. For instance, for every day light use by the average consumer, smaller "PC's" will be used ie; tablets and consoles. Used not just for gaming but social networking and internet browsing. Although for the enthusiast and business type, desktops will always be there for heavy application usage.

Anyway, back to the purpose of the thread. I have taken a deeper look at the PS4 (as more and more info rolls out) and I go back on my statement earlier. The PS4 IS a nice change in the console industry. For me though, it's just another console. It doesn't change the way people do gaming. I was hoping for the next evolution of gaming. In which, that game that Bungie is working on has my interest peeked. From what I understand, it's a live uncontrolled MMO style game. I say uncontrolled because what i have read the online universe will have a AI bases to it. I am hoping it's a type of AI that reads and responds to user interaction at an educated level.

 

[CrazyMike]

They dont push my PC. I get 50-60fps in BF3 maxed and thats only because I have vsync on that it wont go past 60. Far Cry 3 I havent played on PC, but from what I seen it had nothing in mind but ugly. Skyrim, same deal, 50fps no problem.

what resolution are you playing at?

 

[spirit]

Man, this thread blew right up! lol All this discussion about PC vs Console (or some have put it, PC gaming is dieing out).

That discussion was kind of inevitable. As soon as you put any kind of thread about consoles on a forum full of PC gamers, you'll get that kind of discussion.

To throw my own opinion in, I don't see PC gaming dying in the future anytime soon, but it is true that more people my age game on Xboxes and PlayStations. Probably because the consoles are cheaper and all their friends are online and playing the games they are playing because they too have a console. Does this mean PC gaming is going to die in the future though? Nope. There's always going to be a market for PC gamers, just like there is going to be for console gamers.

 

[M1kkelZR]

They dont push my PC. I get 50-60fps in BF3 maxed and thats only because I have vsync on that it wont go past 60. Far Cry 3 I havent played on PC, but from what I seen it had nothing in mind but ugly. Skyrim, same deal, 50fps no problem.

But we didn't say that you are amazing and they don't push your specific hardware, we said these games are hardware pushers. We couldn't care less if you can play Skyrim or BF3 at 50 fps no problem. About FC3 comment: Far Cry 3 I havent played on PC, but from what I seen it had nothing in mind but ugly. Basically, you are the current dumb gamer. Game graphics must be AMAZING or I can't enjoy the story, gameplay or anything. The day I say that about a game I want is the day I shoot myself in the face.

Also, by saying that you doubt Aastii's game design perspective makes me cringe, it doesn't seem to me that you have the most amount of knowledge on this subject. As Tech savy said: he does not play LoL, doesn't know it nor does he know anyone that does. It is still the biggest and fastest growing game. Its simple yet challenging.

Now on to your funny thing of BF3 was not primarily made for PC. Yes it was, If I play BF3 on my PC which I sometimes, VERY rarely do Its a terrible game in my opinion, and then play it at a friends place on the X360/PS3 it feels and play 10x better on PC.

MMO's on PC are extremely fun, Free2Play or Pay2Play its still fun. Might not be everyones "cup of tea" but still are very good genres and do extremely well for any kind of gamer. That PC gaming is dying is total crap. It wont be obsolete, Console gaming is terrible which everyone knows. Well at least everyone with 3/4 of a brain cell anyway.

Now hardware in the console has evolved alot. Maybe not to the point that they are amazing pieces of machinery but still alot better than what we could've imagined a few years back. This is all based on my opinion by the way.

In all honesty, PC gaming is in a dip yes but will come back. But still gaming is gaming is gaming, whether you play on a PC or Xbox or playstation. Its all the same, different platform and different controls, graphics are amazing and the better the graphics the better the game. That is what I've seen alot lately which is sad in my opinion. I don't care about the look as long as I enjoy the game. Hell I played skyrim on my old laptop, windowed 640x480 everything low and still hit 20fps. Looked like total crap but I enjoyed the game.

 

[Aastii]

Im pretty sure your the one smoking. Like I said, I have GTA4 modded out, and yes it looks good, but its nothing more than blur effects with increased texture resolutions. Thats it. The lighting system is still the same, with some tweaks, the shading is the same, the "high" resolution textures are not much different from the standard which begs the question why waste 4GB downloading them, and at the end of the day its still a DX9 game from 2008 that lacks any modern graphical features. With or without mods.

Games are cheaper on PC? Since when? I just paid $65 after taxes for Crysis 3 on PC. Guess how much it would have cost to get it on Xbox? Exactly the same. PC games cost the same as console games when they are new. Maybe in your part of the world things are different, but I highly doubt PC games come out cheaper there than anywhere else.

Try building a $500 PC that will play BF3 or Crysis 3 maxed or even your GTA4 with mods. Wont happen. Especially with GTA4. Optimization is the reason consoles still exist. Because it is their sole purpose and design to do so.

It cost me $1,500 to build a PC from the ground up to play Crysis 3 and BF3 at acceptable frame rates with nearly the same quality as my Xbox (AA and AF aside). So dont even give me the "PC gaming is cheaper" round about because its clearly not. Especially if you factor in your blessed pay by the month MMOs. Then PC gaming becomes as expensive as owning my CL600.

You believe BF3 was designed for PC because EA and Dice told you so and because you believe it was released on PC first (which it wasnt). Where are you getting your information? EA is hardly a reliable source, as all they have been doing for the past decade is trying to milk all the money they can from customers like you with all their DLC that cost 4x as much as the game.

As for the valve games, if anyone bought those for console it would surprise me. Because until they finally did release Counter-Strike for console it was played out and old. Im sure it probably sold about 100 copies or so though. Very successful console title I can imagine.

Make all that money back on games? What are you talking about? You PAY money for games they dont pay you to buy them.....

I am questioning myself about whether you are trolling now. You can't see the difference between default GTA and the photorealism mod? Go to Specsavers mate.

Games on PC have always been cheaper than consoles. As a single example (first on the site home page):

http://www.game.co.uk/en/tomb-raider-game-exclusive-explorer-edition-187594

http://www.game.co.uk/en/tomb-raider-game-exclusive-explorer-edition-187591

http://www.game.co.uk/en/tomb-raider-game-exclusive-explorer-edition-187597

Save yourself 25 quid by getting it on PC. In 4 games time you have reduced the difference in price by £100

Nowhere was $500 mentioned, the conversion rate is not 1:1 because the pound is stronger than the dollar. £500 is around $750. I know this is doable because I build a system last month for £450, playing every game on high settings @1920x1080. That extra £50 would have been an upgraded graphics card pushing everything to max settings.

You don't seem to like facts but do like a lot of speculation. If Valve had sold 100 copies of The Orange Box, that would have been known... Gabe started out despising the PS3, even calling it a mistake, but later did deals with Sony. If the console sales were that bad I am pretty sure he wouldn't have been so pally pally. How about we stick to the facts, first and foremost.

Finally, I can't believe I am having to explain the concept of something making it's money back or paying for itself, but here goes : The money difference at first is large, however with games sales included that difference shrinks to eventually 0, and then you start having it sway the other way, so you have paid more to play on a console than you have PC. So whilst yes, it isn't free, you have got the same games, but better hardware, better upgradeability, a more versatile and useful system and a system that provides a much better gaming experience.


I am going to add another thing onto the "list of crap that you keep showing us about yourself", you seem to want games that are completely realistic. This isn't a film, book or TV show, this is real life and we aren't going to get that for another few years at least, so you have two options:

1. Stop playing games and bitching about them because you obviously don't enjoy them (wah, wah, nothing meets expectations, wah, wah)

2. Deal with what you have and stop being sore that you wasted your money on unnecessary hardware for your needs

 

[Troncoso]

You guys need to calm down. You are moving completely away from the topic.

 

[Darren]

You guys need to calm down. You are moving completely away from the topic.

Also you're not going to convince each other to your opinion anyway. Just drop it. I like PC gaming better but consoles have their merits as well. You have your opinions and it's not my job to convince you to mine.

 

[G80FTW]

I am questioning myself about whether you are trolling now. You can't see the difference between default GTA and the photorealism mod? Go to Specsavers mate.

Games on PC have always been cheaper than consoles. As a single example (first on the site home page):

http://www.game.co.uk/en/tomb-raider-game-exclusive-explorer-edition-187594

http://www.game.co.uk/en/tomb-raider-game-exclusive-explorer-edition-187591

http://www.game.co.uk/en/tomb-raider-game-exclusive-explorer-edition-187597

Save yourself 25 quid by getting it on PC. In 4 games time you have reduced the difference in price by £100

Nowhere was $500 mentioned, the conversion rate is not 1:1 because the pound is stronger than the dollar. £500 is around $750. I know this is doable because I build a system last month for £450, playing every game on high settings @1920x1080. That extra £50 would have been an upgraded graphics card pushing everything to max settings.

You don't seem to like facts but do like a lot of speculation. If Valve had sold 100 copies of The Orange Box, that would have been known... Gabe started out despising the PS3, even calling it a mistake, but later did deals with Sony. If the console sales were that bad I am pretty sure he wouldn't have been so pally pally. How about we stick to the facts, first and foremost.

Finally, I can't believe I am having to explain the concept of something making it's money back or paying for itself, but here goes : The money difference at first is large, however with games sales included that difference shrinks to eventually 0, and then you start having it sway the other way, so you have paid more to play on a console than you have PC. So whilst yes, it isn't free, you have got the same games, but better hardware, better upgradeability, a more versatile and useful system and a system that provides a much better gaming experience.


I am going to add another thing onto the "list of crap that you keep showing us about yourself", you seem to want games that are completely realistic. This isn't a film, book or TV show, this is real life and we aren't going to get that for another few years at least, so you have two options:

1. Stop playing games and bitching about them because you obviously don't enjoy them (wah, wah, nothing meets expectations, wah, wah)

2. Deal with what you have and stop being sore that you wasted your money on unnecessary hardware for your needs

Is it odd that those links you posted have that game the same price for PS3 and PC? Maybe they made a mistake

I find it hard to believe, that people in a computer forum, do not care about graphics. But, if thats the case, then fine. Im not saying I cant enjoy a game that has bad graphics, I game on my 360 all the time it doesnt bother me. Like I said, what bothers me, is devs not making use of current generation PC hardware. Which they havent done since 2007. Which also happened to be early years of the current consoles so the hardware difference was much smaller.

Also, I game at 1920x1080. With every game.

I built my PC to play the games of this year, because I was expecting games to start rolling out with DX11 features left and right since DX11 has been out for sometime. If someone had told me last year when I built this, that there wont be any games demanding enough to push a GTX680 I never woulda bought it. But I dont think anyone could have known that. Its not that I bought hardware that exceeding my needs, its that the developers didnt give me a product to meet the needs of my hardware.

 

[G80FTW]

Take a look at the rate of which video cards are coming out!

Graphics cards are not coming out any faster than they have been for the past 20-30 years....

 

[Darren]

Why would companies develop games that can only afford to be run by maybe 5 percent of the PC gaming public. That doesn't make any business sense to make full use of a card that very few people are capable of running. It's about the money and more people run on mediocre cards at best. If you want to to turn on every graphical setting to the max you still need a plenty expensive card to do so. The 680 is just overkill for anything out right now.You're trying to blame the system and the market as a whole for spending too much on something you don't need. In a few years though you'll be happy you bought that when I'm limping along with my 7850 while you're still destroying games with your card. You just bought something that isn't being fully used yet. Heck they're not still fully using the 580 yet really.