BUSH or KELLY?
- Thread starter smitherz
- Start date
SFR
Truth fears no questions
In Ben's quote he said "essential liberty" I dont consider the freedoms of people who are in America illegally or in this country to kill us, ESSENTIAL.
and about Hitler: Read what he said again. And ask yourself... is this not what everyone country wants? Then ask yourself: How am I going to go about achieving this?
What you fail to quote him on is his desire to blame everything on everyone who was not German, and his planning and horrific execution of millions of people and the eradication of an entire race/religion. He saw Germans in a time of crisis and used them to kill innocent people. I CANNOT and will not consider Saddam Hussein and OSAMA BIN LADEN and THEIR FOLLOWERS INNOCENT PEOPLE!
They are murderers, PERIOD. The Europeans that were killed at the hand of Hitler were not murderers, they were ordinary people.
So, ... the fact that Hitler is quoted as saying evil exists and we need to insure our domestic security is a valid point. But WHAT HE ACTUALLY DID instead is FAR different that what we are seeing today.
You comparison between what hitler said and DID and what America and my president has said and IS DOING is so incredibly far off that I am not only offended by what you said but am saddened that instead of remembering history and learning from it, you TWIST it to help continue the atrocities that this world faces today.
You need to reread a few history books and Stop taking QUOTES OUT OF CONTEXT.. LOOK AT THE BIG PICTURE..
Look at who Hitler was and what he did and HOW he did it.
Then look at the FANATIC arabs in this world... and ask yourself if you want your country to turn out like HOLLAND...
...before you answer.. do some research on Holland and what the fanatic Arabs have done to that country.
zkiller
<b>VIP Member</b>
hitler was a deciever. he did many things for germany that helped the country and it's people, but they also ultimately helped him full fill his plans of war, morder and world domination.
by taking civil liberties from the people, he was capable of feeding them false information and thereby decieving them of the truth.
that's why national security can only go so far before it becomes a problem.
i do understand what you are trying to say, but honestly, we will never put an end to terrorism, it's just not possible. we might be able to make it harder for them, but we won't be able to put an end to it. we are trying to build ourselves an illusion of control around a problem that we will never truelly master. if we don't really have control of a car due to to many unpredictable outside factors, how can one believe to be able to control a problem so much more complex.
i am not saying that we should just stop and not even try, but i am saying that our civil liberties are more important.
did that make sense?
by taking civil liberties from the people, he was capable of feeding them false information and thereby decieving them of the truth.
that's why national security can only go so far before it becomes a problem.
i do understand what you are trying to say, but honestly, we will never put an end to terrorism, it's just not possible. we might be able to make it harder for them, but we won't be able to put an end to it. we are trying to build ourselves an illusion of control around a problem that we will never truelly master. if we don't really have control of a car due to to many unpredictable outside factors, how can one believe to be able to control a problem so much more complex.
i am not saying that we should just stop and not even try, but i am saying that our civil liberties are more important.
did that make sense?
SFR
Truth fears no questions
Yes. It did.
I agree that civil liberties are VERY important. But "civil liberties" can be abused. Organizations hide and thrive under that idea and create many of the problems we see today.
Take a look at Holland. (the reason I bring this up is it is a perfect example of what America can become in a decade or less.) Radical, and I stress the word Radical (or fanatic) Arabs have been living in Holland because of its incredible LIBERAL ideas and laws. That country's laws have slowly been etched away and now the government has little control over its people.
There is a balance between OUR freedoms and the government's LAWS.
I have always been one to ULTIMATLY hold civil liberties above security. Now the question becomes: How important our many of our civil liberties?
Are you willing to give up the ability to walk into an Airport and board a plane without being searched? I am ready to give it up.
Are you willing to spend the money (tax money) on national security and on our troops (some of which are and were my friends) in Iraq and around the rest of the world? I am.
I cant cure or change anyone’s opinion on a computer forum... but all I want is for people to think. About the big picture.
Think about your family present and future.. think about the world you want them to live in.
I agree, a military state would be horrible.. and our civil liberties are important... but how important?.. and what WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO GIVE UP IN ORDER TO take just one step to make it a safer world for YOUR FAMILY?
I agree that civil liberties are VERY important. But "civil liberties" can be abused. Organizations hide and thrive under that idea and create many of the problems we see today.
Take a look at Holland. (the reason I bring this up is it is a perfect example of what America can become in a decade or less.) Radical, and I stress the word Radical (or fanatic) Arabs have been living in Holland because of its incredible LIBERAL ideas and laws. That country's laws have slowly been etched away and now the government has little control over its people.
There is a balance between OUR freedoms and the government's LAWS.
I have always been one to ULTIMATLY hold civil liberties above security. Now the question becomes: How important our many of our civil liberties?
Are you willing to give up the ability to walk into an Airport and board a plane without being searched? I am ready to give it up.
Are you willing to spend the money (tax money) on national security and on our troops (some of which are and were my friends) in Iraq and around the rest of the world? I am.
I cant cure or change anyone’s opinion on a computer forum... but all I want is for people to think. About the big picture.
Think about your family present and future.. think about the world you want them to live in.
I agree, a military state would be horrible.. and our civil liberties are important... but how important?.. and what WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO GIVE UP IN ORDER TO take just one step to make it a safer world for YOUR FAMILY?
zkiller
<b>VIP Member</b>
well, i just read the rest of your post. i am considered a federal law enforcement officers, as i am part of the air forces, security forces. i do not consider searches at airports and so forth to be a breach of someones privacy. we search vehicles at random every day and at times we do 100% checks, as ordered by the commander. people hate to have to undergo them, but i don't see where the problem with something as a simple search is, unless you are trying to hide something. the better you cooperate and the less attitude we get, the faster we are done. which usually, we don't take more than 5 minutes of your time anyways. but when talking about security and breaching the sanctaty of someones home, someones privacy, that is whole nother story. that i do not support in anyway, or manner.
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