32-bit or 64-bit?

[jonnyp11]

Why do you want a UPS? Couldn't find it in the long trail of posts, so sorry if its a dumb question.

if the power cuts then you have time to save and shut the comp off so you don't loose anything.

you still have the gpu i don't think you need and for the case it depends on what kind of look you want, we generally recomend corsair (probs the bently of cases), fractal design (idk), or cooler master (lambo, looks cool and nice)

 

[Honest Bill]

Why do you want a UPS? Couldn't find it in the long trail of posts, so sorry if its a dumb question.

No question about computers is dumb to me...I'm the dumbest guy who posts here. :^)

The UPS will give me a few minutes to shut down properly ... I work remotely from home using software on a server elsewhere and a power outage (we get quite a few) sometimes means I will lose a lot of work ... time is money and there is no greater aggravation than having to redo something that sometimes takes hours to put together.

 

[Honest Bill]

you still have the gpu i don't think you need and for the case it depends on what kind of look you want, we generally recomend corsair (probs the bently of cases), fractal design (idk), or cooler master (lambo, looks cool and nice)

Looks don't matter to me (heresy, I know) ... not a gamer and only care about durability and functionality ... I was told that the Antec was a tank, so I bit.

 

[jonnyp11]

they're not bad but lian li are supposed to be the best built, meant to put them in there, and they are all professional looking cases other than one or 2 super high end ones, they have a snail shell looking case.

 

[Honest Bill]

you still have the gpu i don't think you need

The PNY GeForce GT 430? Why do I not need it? I was told that it will run 2 monitors very well ... two engines or something ... plus, it's rated very highly at newegg.

 

[jonnyp11]

The PNY GeForce GT 430? Why do I not need it? I was told that it will run 2 monitors very well ... two engines or something ... plus, it's rated very highly at newegg.

do you need 2 monitors? if you do then it will be fine but otherwise it is pointless. and this should do what you want for less money

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814131338

 

[Benny Boy]

Caution, lengthy...

Maybe if you had more ammo when you talked to your builder. Probly wouldn't matter to them but worth a shot.

Did they give you any flack for 64bit since they recommended 32bit? I doubt it since they are going to use it knowing what program(s) its for.

The latest quote:

The mb is on the cheap/lower quality side compared to your total investment/budget. ATX size is better and will fit the 300. For build quality it needs to be in the $120 etail range. Instead of B75, try for Z68 or Z77. Z68/Z77 is better/newer tech of the 3 and altho some features(not to be confused with build quality) are not a requirement for you at this time, motherboard longevity can be worth having. If down the road you want some features Z68/Z77 have, whether its with the other latest quoted components as they are, or with certain upgrades including processor, you'd be not only ready but you won't have to buy a diff mb and Windows, nor have to reinstall Windows and disrupt your programs, data, and os setup.

IB3550 has a couple features that SB2500 doesn't. You won't use those features at least atm so for all intent and purposes, if you take those features away from 3550, you have a 2500. Same # of cores/same thread count/same stock speed(Ghz). They e-tail cost the same.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5771/the-intel-ivy-bridge-core-i7-3770k-review/2
With all other componets equal a question to the builder might be, would the 2500 cost less for them to build and if so how much. Since I'm sure they put a premium on the ones that have an I and a B, it should cost less. But since they get them for at least the same price as each other, they probly keep that profit built in. On the open market the price diff between 2400 3.1Ghz/2380P 3.1Ghz/2500 3.3Ghz is $20 or less. The diff. for 2500/2500k is $10, 2500/3550 is $0, and 2500K/3570K is $10, with a $40 diff between the lowest and highest. You can see the reason why when its close to $200 the 3570K worth the bit more $.

What we don't know is how the builder will price's these builds of same components with those various processors.

The current B75 mb doesn't have the features required to take advantage of K and other features.

Judging from the price of the latest quote, they put a pretty high premium on naming/upgrading your parts. No way no how are the changes worth the extra $500.

Current vs Original:

CPU performance for your use. Gained .3Ghz. Thats it! Which means with your uses there will be zero diff.

MB - Same thing only different. Same price range and same end result as the previous and as mentioned above. Different brand and/or model perhaps. Could be the same mb since we don't know what mb was used in the original quote.

It now has RAM for dual channel operation. Whoopee loll. > With 10600, 10660, and 10666 all being 1333Mhz you've got 10600. Honestly tho, it will perforn well. Some programs respond better to faster memory and I believe that includes yours. If all was fair in love and war, the better 1600Mhz would only be a few bucks more. Also it has 2x as many GB's as are realistic. Beyond 2x4GB won't make it faster or future proof it. Dead money. 2x4gb 1600 @1.5volt(or lower v) will increase performance from said 4x4gb and save some $. Use less power too.

Added the SSD :good: Best move yet. Congradulations

I see the HDD is now a Western Digital Black FAEX. Nice drive and would be the top pick for many builders because it ranks right up there in speed (for hdd's) and has industry leading 5yr manufacturer's warranty.

Do you need/use 2 cd/dvd drives or are they part of some kind of fluff?

PNY? Meh, not the better but ok at that level. A step down from the 520. Do you think you'll ever want more than 2 monitors? 2 max with either GPU. Intel's HD grapsics will run 2 monitors but if you run across a time when you need a bit more graphical oomph you'll have a tad.

Earthwatts is good. Since it won't have a high powered GPU(the most power hungry part) much less 2 of them as that 650w is capable of, its more dead money unless you want to keep GPU options open or if thats all they offer in the quality dept which I doubt. Certainly they have a respectable 450-500ishW unit instead of the higher priced/overkilling 650w.??

Case + power supply. As noted the 300 cools well but has no way of managing the cables other than using something like peel&stick zip-tie mounts and tieing the cables around case perimiters. A power supply that has all the cables sleeved(instead of 1)would be better for this 300 case, but the bigger factor is how much effort the builder will use since you want unobstructed air flow. No matter the system you get, expressing concern for cable management won't hurt.

They must be far away from you or you would pick it up and save the $70. Which means if it has to be sent in it will take at least several days or longer to get it back? Of course if anything ever did go wrong you could pop in here to see if it was something simple, something that you taking care of wouldn't void the warranty of.

With the latest quote there's quite a bit of unjust exspence and not enough on the motherboard.
_________________________
Two possible ideas:

A. What would be good would be if you could select(not buy because they wouldn't go for that)your own components and they build/warranty it. Even if you had to use thier parts lists you could share that list here, and optimize it.

B. As a base line for parts and pricing, for a system with good a balance of quality and excellent performance, ask them - how much for:
The latest quoted system except,
-A quality Z68 motherboard.
-i5-2500
-2x4GB 1600 memory
-Just 1 cd/dvd drive unless you want 2.
-A quality but lower wattage power supply around the 500w (give or take a few) range. Perhaps with sleeved cables but not madatory.

After asking for that ^ and how much that^ would cost, ask them how much to change only the processor to 2500K, then price for 3570K.
Then either,
A. Post the parts list.
B. Post your findings with details on the mb and ps.

How does that sound?

 

[Honest Bill]

do you need 2 monitors?

Yes ... I have the software we use in our business open on one monitor and surf multiple sites on the other ... saves me a lot of time over the course of a day not having to constantly minimize and navigate all that I do using one monitor, and time is money in my biz. Plus, I'm starting to play around with the market, and the more monitors the better when it comes to that.

 

[jonnyp11]

there are like 6 display capable graphics cards out but they aren't cheap

 

[Honest Bill]

Thanks for the incredibly thorough and detailed analysis of my system quote, Benny Boy ... you guys never cease to amaze me.

"The mb is on the cheap/lower quality side compared to your total investment/budget. ATX size is better and will fit the 300. For build quality it needs to be in the $120 retail range. Instead of B75, try for Z68 or Z77. Z68/Z77 is better/newer tech of the 3 and altho some features(not to be confused with build quality) are not a requirement for you at this time, motherboard longevity can be worth having. If down the road you want some features Z68/Z77 have, whether its with the other latest quoted components as they are, or with certain upgrades including processor, you'd be not only ready but you won't have to buy a diff mb and Windows, nor have to reinstall Windows and disrupt your programs, data, and os setup."

"The current B75 mb doesn't have the features required to take advantage of K and other features."

Do I, or will I ever, need K for a non-gaming business machine?

I think I follow your logic, I think ("have to buy a diff Windows"?) ...

cheapest gigabyte Z68 ... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128538

cheapest gigabyte Z77 ... http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128547

cheapest gigabyte Z68/Z77 ... not one at newegg

Do I really need to be worried about this motherboard for a non-gaming business machine for the next 4-5 years. If so, which lowest price gigabyte board will protect me for the future?


"Judging from the price of the latest quote, they put a pretty high premium on naming/upgrading your parts. No way no how are the changes worth the extra $500."

Yeah, it seems like the price has increased disproportionately to the upgrades, but it's for my business and it's a business expense and they will be taking care of any issues and I won't be stuck with downtime, so I'm willing to overlook it ... don't get me wrong, I'm not a spendthrift, but I'm already into this build time-wise much more than I can afford to be ... time is money.


"It now has RAM for dual channel operation. Whoopee loll. > With 10600, 10660, and 10666 all being 1333Mhz you've got 10600. Honestly tho, it will perforn well. Some programs respond better to faster memory and I believe that includes yours. If all was fair in love and war, the better 1600Mhz would only be a few bucks more. Also it has 2x as many GB's as are realistic. Beyond 2x4GB won't make it faster or future proof it. Dead money. 2x4gb 1600 @1.5volt(or lower v) will increase performance from said 4x4gb and save some $. Use less power too."

You really lost me here. So, do I have the right kind of RAM? Will I not receive any benefit from 16GB or RAM? I'm confused.


"Added the SSD :good: Best move yet. Congradulations"

The plan is to run the OS on the SSD, leaving the WD hard drive for everything else.


"Do you need/use 2 cd/dvd drives or are they part of some kind of fluff?"

Not really, but I occasionally burn a CD from another ... the drives are cheap.


"PNY? Meh, not the better but ok at that level. A step down from the 520. Do you think you'll ever want more than 2 monitors? 2 max with either GPU. Intel's HD grapsics will run 2 monitors but if you run across a time when you need a bit more graphical oomph you'll have a tad."

There is a possibility that I will want to add a 3rd monitor ... I'm told this video card can handle a 3rd, though it's pushing it. Is there a better card? Any considerations other than the video card when adding monitors?

 

[Benny Boy]

-Do I, or will I ever, need K for a non-gaming business machine?

Not right now, but if the price is close now and yrs down the road as/when things change as tech does, that reserved performance could be there saving a cpu upgrade when the time comes. But to answer your question, no doesn't have to be K right now. If in 3 yrs you wanted/needed a litttle more processing power you could just change the cpu.

-I think I follow your logic, I think ("have to buy a diff Windows"?) ...

Your Windows 7 will be "tied" to the mb its installed to. And the builder will be your MS support. MS doesn't support OEM versions of Windows and they don't allow the product key from the OEM version to be installed on a diff model mb. So your operating system and the mb will always be a pair. Changing the mb from the original Windows install = new Windows license key.
A higher quality mb, along with the added features that higher quality gets you, helps ensure your platform(the mb/cpu/which also dictates memory type) and OS will last through the years as tech and probably needs progress. Would the current B75 be ok through the term of the warranty and as far as functionality? Yeah. Would you wish before or after that you had the tech/features of a better mb for whatevers mainstream at the time? Up to you. I just hate to see you get a $75 mb out of 1.5-2k. They should be dispersing your budget amongst the parts better than they are.

Either of those you mb's you linked. Or if you can do this one
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128543

-You really lost me here. So, do I have the right kind of RAM? Will I not receive any benefit from 16GB or RAM? I'm confused.

Yes, you have the right kind of memory ie its DDR3 1333mhz. Your Intel product specs for memory can go to the next level - 1600mhz. You may see better performance from your programs by moving to 1600. And to give you an idea, a gaming rig doesn't use 8gb of memory while playing intense games. So, the proposed build with its 16gb of 1333 wouldn't perform as well for you as 8gb of 1600mhz and with fewer memory sicks you'll be using less power. Memory is cheap and builders get it even cheaper. Putting or advertising 16GB RAM looks good to the public who thinks more it will make the pc faster. If you have a 1/2 tank and it takes a 1/4 tank to get there, filling it up won't get you there faster Have them change it to 2x4gb 1600mhz and they should charge you less too. So yep, you have compatible RAM, and no 16GB won't benifit you.

-There is a possibility that I will want to add a 3rd monitor ... I'm told this video card can handle a 3rd, though it's pushing it. Is there a better card? Any considerations other than the video card when adding monitors?

No other considerations, and this card is a pretty good step up from 430. With the 3 connectors types it has you can run 3 monitors and still have some reserve graphics power. Its has Eyefinity as well.
As compared to PNY 430
440/6670 comparisom

I wonder what the fee would be for one of those Gigabyte boards, i5 2500, 8gb 1600, the 6670, and less watts.

 

[Honest Bill]

-You really lost me here. So, do I have the right kind of RAM? Will I not receive any benefit from 16GB or RAM? I'm confused.

Yes, you have the right kind of memory ie its DDR3 1333mhz. Your Intel product specs for memory can go to the next level - 1600mhz. You may see better performance from your programs by moving to 1600. And to give you an idea, a gaming rig doesn't use 8gb of memory while playing intense games. So, the proposed build with its 16gb of 1333 wouldn't perform as well for you as 8gb of 1600mhz and with fewer memory sicks you'll be using less power. Memory is cheap and builders get it even cheaper. Putting or advertising 16GB RAM looks good to the public who thinks more it will make the pc faster. If you have a 1/2 tank and it takes a 1/4 tank to get there, filling it up won't get you there faster Have them change it to 2x4gb 1600mhz and they should charge you less too. So yep, you have compatible RAM, and no 16GB won't benifit you.

Now that's the kind of info I needed ... what about this memory?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104173

 

[Honest Bill]

Windows 7 Home or Pro?

One more related thing about memory ... am I correct in saying that the only advantage to Pro for my application is that you are not limited to 16GB of memory, as you are with Home? If so, is that reason enough to fork up the extra $50 to get Pro?

 

[Benny Boy]

The only thing different from what you linked is, 1.5 volt or lower to stay within Intel specs, and it doesn't mean it will run slower.

For what your doing with this pc you'll have to come up with some RAM hogging uses to need more than 8gb let alone 16. So, no to 64bit Pro just for memory. But...
Here's Premium/Pro. Among the few diffs is a networking feature and remote host. Since your builder is your IT, they will know if Pro has any "other than RAM" features you need for work or home.

 

[Honest Bill]

The only thing different from what you linked is, 1.5 volt or lower to stay within Intel specs, and it doesn't mean it will run slower.

So, is the memory I linked better or the one you linked?

For what your doing with this pc you'll have to come up with some RAM hogging uses to need more than 8gb let alone 16. So, no to 64bit Pro just for memory. But...
Here's Premium/Pro. Among the few diffs is a networking feature and remote host. Since your builder is your IT, they will know if Pro has any "other than RAM" features you need for work or home.

Exactly what would cause me to ever want to have more than 16GB of RAM for a non-gaming business machine?

 

[Benny Boy]

Just a sec, let me get my sunglasses on .......ahh, that's better

So, is the memory I linked better or the one you linked?

1.5 volt or lower to stay within Intel specs.

**Exactly what would cause me to ever want to have more than 16GB of RAM for a non-gaming business machine?... ... other than working remotely in WinTOTAL, I store and play with photos quite a bit, surf the net a lot with many windows open at once, play the market a bit with dual monitors, and listen to music while I'm doing it all.

'Non-gaming' isn't really a reference > 16gb since [while in game] will use maybe 5gb.

You stated other uses besides work so this is a home pc as well. And none of that multitask use on 2 or 3 screens will need more than 8gb.

**If you or anyone else that uses the pc will do anything besides what you've already mentioned above then only you or them knows what that is/would be.

Video editing is an example of a RAM hungry task and can be done with 8gb. The size of the edit would determin if more than 8gb would be helpful.

So, no to 64bit Pro just for memory.

Because everything gathered from you in this thread says 8gb is plenty and that the need for more isn't there.

16gb is a TON of memory. I don't blame you for wondering since pre-builders use 16gb left and right as a marketing tool. Premium is fine as long as you don't need any of the other features the other versions have.

 

[Honest Bill]

What about this memory?

"The only thing different from what you linked is, 1.5 volt or lower to stay within Intel specs, and it doesn't mean it will run slower."

Is this just as good for my system as the memory you suggest as linked above?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820104173

 

[Jiniix]

cheapest gigabyte Z68/Z77 ... not one at newegg

Cute

One more related thing about memory ... am I correct in saying that the only advantage to Pro for my application is that you are not limited to 16GB of memory, as you are with Home? If so, is that reason enough to fork up the extra $50 to get Pro?

http://i815.photobucket.com/albums/zz71/Jiniix/AdvancedWindows7Comparison.png

It's a list of all the features of all the different Windows 7s.

For example, as it was mentioned a lot, you don't get Windows XP Mode.