Buying Advice For Mac?

[Demilich]

Yes, that's pretty much what I go on to say...due to the fact that there are so many more PCs, more hackers write viruses for the PCs, that is the bigger target, easier target.

The built better does not come from specs. My Dell XPS is of better quality than a cheaper computer of the same specs. My XPS would also cost more. When you examine the case of the average PC, it is usually quite cheap. Not always, but often. If I built myself a PC, and my parents bought a computer from the store, both had the same specs, I can almost guarantee that my computer will be better. The Macs are not. The material used is of higher quality. I do not remember if Apple tests ALL the hardware or not, but I am thinking they do. They also test the PARTS, I do not know about the computers, that I agree would be impractical. That is also one of the reasons they can charge more. If you think about it, people buy less of the Macs partially because they cost more...this gives Apple more time. Like you said, PCs hold 90% of the market share.

Also, you should know that I am not coming up with this, or just have that opinion. I learned this recently from my instructor who has been in IT for 20 odd years.

I am also not giving false advertisements. I am listing cons and pros. My personal opinion on Macs are that they are a luxury. They often look fancier, (externally) sleeker.

I understand your point. I'm sure your Dell XPS is quite a nice computer. To be honest, I don't consider Mac's luxurious at all, but I would definitely consider your Dell luxurious. Also, I'm sure your IT instructor is an intelligent person, and knows what he's doing better than most anybody else. However, as I see in this forum much more than I like, even experienced professionals have sometimes opinions they wish were facts, because they are loyal to one brand. A prime example is the Hard Drive section of this forum. There are constant raves, and posts by forum Mods, VIP members, and forum users of how one hard drive is better than the other, based on their experiences with that manufacturer. Which is, of course, ridiculous. Every hard drive in the world is produced on an assembly line, the same way, and marketing is key. Same goes for Mac's and PC's. Mac throws some shiny armor on their computer, throws out a couple slanderous commercials, state Macs never get viruses, wallah, it gives it that luxurious feel. In my experience, for example, I own 5 PC's currently, 2 of which are over 6 years old, pre-built, and run like new. Only one has recently broke, and it was a newer PC, but it happens, I realize. If I owned the same amount of Mac's, I believe it would be the same result. I just paid much less for those PC's.

 

[Dystopia]

I understand your point. I'm sure your Dell XPS is quite a nice computer. To be honest, I don't consider Mac's luxurious at all, but I would definitely consider your Dell luxurious. Also, I'm sure your IT instructor is an intelligent person, and knows what he's doing better than most anybody else. However, as I see in this forum much more than I like, even experienced professionals have sometimes opinions they wish were facts, because they are loyal to one brand. A prime example is the Hard Drive section of this forum. There are constant raves, and posts by forum Mods, VIP members, and forum users of how one hard drive is better than the other, based on their experiences with that manufacturer. Which is, of course, ridiculous. Every hard drive in the world is produced on an assembly line, the same way, and marketing is key. Same goes for Mac's and PC's. Mac throws some shiny armor on their computer, throws out a couple slanderous commercials, state Macs never get viruses, wallah, it gives it that luxurious feel. In my experience, for example, I own 5 PC's currently, 2 of which are over 6 years old, pre-built, and run like new. Only one has recently broke, and it was a newer PC, but it happens, I realize. If I owned the same amount of Mac's, I believe it would be the same result. I just paid much less for those PC's.

I love my XPS

Anyway, yeah, some of the guys are are somewhat biased. Kind of like I am somewhat biased towards the Cooler Master Storm Scout case. I loved it. So whenever someone wants to spend $100~, I recommend.

You've probably maintained your PCs, which is exactly what I was pointing out to the OP, a lot of errors are user errors. My computers run for quite sometime even when dated like crazy, whereas I hated using my parents computer because it was NOT maintained.

While all hard drives are essentially manufactured the same, and built the same, that doesn't mean they are all the same quality. Buying some random brand versus a Western Digital Caviar Black, for example. The WD is going to be better. Or against the Seagate Barracuda line. Some people don't like that line, because one of their sets of hard drives had a rep for failing. I on the other hand, had a Barracuda, which lasted 4 years until I sold my computer and probably still works great. I also owned the WD Caviar Black. I would recommend the Caviar Black over a Barracuda though, for two reasons, one, it was faster than my Barracuda (even though they were both 7200RPM, another reason people insist on a certain product), and two, it has a good rep for lasting long.

People will automatically recommend products that they had a good experience. Kind of like if you go out to eat, if the food is good, comes out fast, the restaurant is clean, nice waitress/waiter, you are more likely to recommend that over a restaurant that was dirty, food sucks, and has a grumpy waitress/waiter. The problem is when people claim it is automatically the best...

 

[FuryRosewood]

still it boils down to the reasons that pcs cost less...is their using cheaper parts.....macs are using premium server grade hardware.... really comparing mac to pc is like comparing a ford f150 to a peterbuilt.... their just differing hardware sets, and if you want to compare them you need to start comparing similar sets of hardware... at least where the mac pro is concerned.

 

[Demilich]

still it boils down to the reasons that pcs cost less...is their using cheaper parts.....macs are using premium server grade hardware.... really comparing mac to pc is like comparing a ford f150 to a peterbuilt.... their just differing hardware sets, and if you want to compare them you need to start comparing similar sets of hardware... at least where the mac pro is concerned.

I would have to disagree. It depends on the PC that you have either built, or you have either bought pre-built. I guarantee you that Dell XPS uses high quality parts. However, if you purchase an Asus, or maybe an eMachines, sure, they use cheaper parts. That doesn't mean they are necessarily shoddy, either. As for the Mac using "premium server grade hardware", I'm not sure if that makes sense. Most people building a server are going to use "premium server grade hardware". I don't understand your reasoning in stating that Mac uses better hardware. Mac orders the Intel Xeon, orders the ATI card, orders the preferred amount of memory, orders the preferred hard drives, receives these items, and then builds the system accordingly. I could order those parts right now on Newegg. I could order the same system from Dell or HP, as a server. I don't think that Mac receives "special" parts from the manufacturer. Not that I could find, anyways.

 

[Doctor Varney]

The simple fact is that there is nothing a mac can do that a PC cant, but plenty a PC can do that a mac cant...

Actually, kinda the whole reason I'm interested in the Mac is because of what it can't do...

Dr. V

 

[Doctor Varney]

You've probably maintained your PCs, which is exactly what I was pointing out to the OP, a lot of errors are user errors. My computers run for quite sometime even when dated like crazy, whereas I hated using my parents computer because it was NOT maintained.

Well, I've done my best to maintain this system. However, some of the stuff I was recommended by certain friends to use, in order to keep it maintained, failed catastrophically - completely ruining the installation.

Oh, the joys of third party software! If the Mac is more integrated (hardware and software made by the same company) as it claims to be, then it makes a lot of sense to assume it will work better.

I backed everything up onto a USB drive before I did my reinstallation. Now I have come to open certain files on the new installation, they are either corrupted or the programme trying to access them is. Well, that's just great. I'm strangely calm. Actually, I feel numb. It appears I may have lost a year's worth of work on one project, which will cost me dearly. Work that was properly backed up, which I may never be able to get back.

The time it has taken me to get this system anywhere near the previous installation has been ridiculous. It's been a stop/ start, cart load of monkeys. Things which worked before, suddenly act differently.

There's no 'user error' here. You can only do what the system or manual instructs while you are installing. Windows constantly contradicts itself with nonsensical error messages and offers you connundrums which cannot be solved. The times I have tried to load drivers only to be told "No information about your hardware exists at this location" or otherwise installs - then doesn't work. Or works for a while, then suddenly stops working. I quite like the idea that software for the Mac is more limited. The less parts you have, the less there is to go wrong.

The bottom line is, I simply have no confidence in Windows anymore. Every time I come to do something major, like install a programme - the thought is always in the back of my mind that it might not work properly this time. I actually dread turning on the machine these days.

The only thing I can do now, is to go somewhere where I can try out a Mac and see for myself. Or maybe see if I can borrow one off someone.

Dr. V

 

[tech savvy]

still it boils down to the reasons that pcs cost less...is their using cheaper parts.....macs are using premium server grade hardware.... really comparing mac to pc is like comparing a ford f150 to a peterbuilt.... their just differing hardware sets, and if you want to compare them you need to start comparing similar sets of hardware... at least where the mac pro is concerned.

thats a joke right?they use the same hardware as regular PC uses.Macs are waay over rated IMO.the only reason they cost some damn much is what was said earlier, the name/logo,not because it has superior hardware.

for the OP, for the money your going to spend on a Mac you could build a PC that well out-last/out-perform it by far.

 

[C4Radon]

^ Firstly I totally agree ^

Secondly, Dr. Varney, I suggest you just build a new PC and install Windows 7 and or XP (though I prefer Windows 7). It sounds like your computers specs have become obsolete. And from some of your other posts It seems you computer has just failed on you. just like humans computers can "die". Judging from your other posts on different topics, it sounds like your computer is on its last leg.

Just my (quick) 2 cents...

 

[lucasbytegenius]

I say get a Mac. Period.
You can walk into an Apple Store and they're more than eager to let you play with the products, so you can get a feel for it there. I suggest doing that, and then deciding.

 

[C4Radon]

Sorry for the double post, but this deserves it...


This is disgusting.

17-inch: 2.2 GHz
2.2GHz quad-core
Intel Core i7
4GB 1333MHz
750GB 5400-rpm1
Intel HD Graphics 3000
AMD Radeon HD 6750M with 1GB GDDR5
Built-in battery (7 hours)

2500 dollars...

Pay about 1100, build a computer with literally double the power. You wont be sorry.

 

[Okedokey]

Exactly, the simple point is, if you are a brand slave, get a mac. Otherwise, spend half as much and build a PC. If you have trouble doing that, spend 30% less and get someone to do it for you. Simple. The point about Macs having superior parts is just bollocks. An Intel I7 is and Intel I7, period.

 

[Doctor Varney]

^ Firstly I totally agree ^

Secondly, Dr. Varney, I suggest you just build a new PC and install Windows 7 and or XP (though I prefer Windows 7). It sounds like your computers specs have become obsolete. And from some of your other posts It seems you computer has just failed on you. just like humans computers can "die". Judging from your other posts on different topics, it sounds like your computer is on its last leg.

Just my (quick) 2 cents...

No, that just isn't acceptable. I have only had the thing a couple or three years. I know people with old, outdated Macs and they still run as good as the day they bought them. They are not the latest spec but they still have the support and still function within their intended capabilities.

It sounds like your computers specs have become obsolete.

No. How can the specs have become obsolete when I am using software it has run since the day it was built? Software I was using before I even built it? It's a self contained system, built to do a specific set of tasks. It isn't trying to run software that is more advanced than it is.

Dr. V

 

[Okedokey]

Can I just say Doc, you are seemingly a know it all, when clearly you don't know much. If your system is 2 years old, fix it and run it. I really am beginning to lose my patience with this thread as it appears that no matter what advice you get, you reject it. I mean look at your posts above, everything you say starts with "NO", but that is funny, you are not getting anywhere with your own understandings. You're new to this forum and you are beginning to look like a 'troll' as you don't actually try anything suggested. Go away, and try something, then come back. The simply choices have been presented.

If you want your computer (2 year old) to run well, reinstall windows, preferably Win 7, else, go and spend twice as much again on a Mac. That is really the equation. I have old PCs too, that still run brilliantly, why? because I know how to use them. The hardware is the same mate, thats it, its no magic, but clearly you seem incapable of setting up a PC even if it is only a few years old. XP is a 10+ year old OS, upgrade with a fresh install of Win 7, clean out the dust and try again. Simple.

Im unsubscribing to this thread, as 7 pages later, we are no closer to a resolution - even though this must be the most 'forum-ed' topic ever.

 

[Doctor Varney]

Exactly, the simple point is, if you are a brand slave, get a mac.

I suppose it's better than being a slave to Windows. I'm chained to Windows because of the software I have invested in. That's definitely a form of 'slavery' if you think about it. Do you think the freedom to explore an alternative product is 'brand slavery'?

 

[Doctor Varney]

Im unsubscribing to this thread, as 7 pages later, we are no closer to a resolution - even though this must be the most 'forum-ed' topic ever.

Speak for yourself. I've learned a few things since I started asking around and looking deeper into the subject. I'm glad you are unsubscribing to this thread because nothing you have said is even remotely helpful - you're very rude and big-headed as well. I don't ever claim to be a 'know all' yet that's exactly how you come across. I have not rejected looking into Windows 7 as a possibility. Everyone else has been perfectly polite and informative, even whilst disagreeing in a fair manner. I asked you to "keep it friendly" but you have too much of an attitude to deal with it and you've been making cheap shots at me ever since you entered into the conversation. So yes, I'll be glad if you stop posting here.

Dr. V

 

[strollin]

I'm a little late to this conversation but thought I would input my experience. I have been using PCs since 1984 and really don't experience many problems with them, they work pretty well for me. However, I've always heard MAC people go on and on about how wonderful MACs are so about 18 months ago I decided to buy one to see what I was missing.

Talk about sticker shock! I couldn't believe how expensive MACs were. I ended up with the MAC Mini. A 2.0 Ghz Core 2 Duo, 1G RAM and a 120G HDD for $700! OS X, Leopard. Snow Leopard was released shortly afterward and I got a free upgrade. I later added 2 more gig of RAM, and an external 500G HDD. Altogether, I had invested $1000 (excluding monitor) into this machine which was the equivalent of a $400 PC.

I had to supply mouse, keyboard and monitor as MACs don't come with them.

I would rate it as just OK. I personally didn't care for OS X as it seemed to be too cartoonish for my taste (especially the Dock, yuk!). I also felt the OS was very inconsistent. For instance, in Windows, when you click on the "X" in the upper RH corner of an app, it closes the app. With OS X, the "X" is in the upper LH corner but clicking on it does different things depending on the app you're using. Sometimes it closes the app, most times it simply hides the app, other times it's used as a way to close a dialog box instead of having an "OK" button like Windows.

In Windows, the menu bar is at the top of the application window but with OS X the application's menu bar is always at the top of the screen completely disassociated from the app. I disliked that immensely.

I spent lots of time on MAC forums and was amazed at how technically challenged the MAC community was. For instance, there were many posts by Mini owners that were bragging because they figured out how to open the case and add some RAM! There's really only 2 things you can do to upgrade a Mini, add RAM or change out the slow (5400rpm) 120G HDD.

There were no server quality components in the Mini. Standard, off-the-shelf components just like in any other PC.

I realized that much of my dislike of OS X was due to my familiarity with Windows so I put up with the differences but eventually came to the conclusion that the MAC was no better and no worse than any of my other PCs, just substantially more expensive. I used the MAC less and less until it sat collecting dust unused. I gave it to my daughter, she used it for several months then begged me for another Windows PC.

I experienced more system hangs requiring reboots on the Mini than I had ever experienced on other machines. It may have been due to the external HDD I had attached to it which was not an Apple product but was a MAC specific product.

I decided to sell it. MAC people will tell you how well MACs hold their value. What a crock! I couldn't sell it for anywhere near what I had invested in it. I was asking $500 for a 6 month old machine that I had $1000 invested in and was getting offers of $200. I eventually traded it for a Windows laptop with better specs (2.25Ghz Core 2 Duo, 4G RAM, 300G HDD, Vista) then sold the laptop to my sister for $350.

I doubt I will ever consider a MAC again.

 

[BlackDawg]

My advice is to buy the Mac and check it out for yourself. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain. I have both and both have their merits. I like PCs for their flexibility in hardware and upgrade potential along with far more advanced configuration possibilities. Of course along with this comes the headaches of hardware and driver conflicts, but that is the price we pay. Macs seem to have a more polished appearance and feel and OSX does work quite well and stable compared to older versions of Windows. Windows 7 is a huge improvement over XP so if you went that route , I'm confident you would be impressed as well. My advice? Buy the Mac and a copy of windows 7 to try on your PC and you'll have the best of both worlds.

 

[lucasbytegenius]

My advice is to buy the Mac and check it out for yourself. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain. I have both and both have their merits. I like PCs for their flexibility in hardware and upgrade potential along with far more advanced configuration possibilities. Of course along with this comes the headaches of hardware and driver conflicts, but that is the price we pay. Macs seem to have a more polished appearance and feel and OSX does work quite well and stable compared to older versions of Windows. Windows 7 is a huge improvement over XP so if you went that route , I'm confident you would be impressed as well. My advice? Buy the Mac and a copy of windows 7 to try on your PC and you'll have the best of both worlds.

That's a good well-constructed statement taking both worlds into consderation, BlackDawg Good job :good:

 

[BlackDawg]

That's a good well-constructed statement taking both worlds into consderation, BlackDawg Good job :good:

Thanks bud.

 

[Aastii]

Why not go Ubuntu on your current system instead?